The scientific NDE studies performed over the past decades indicate that heightened mental functions can be experienced independently of the body at a time when brain activity is greatly impaired or seemingly absent (such as during cardiac arrest). Some of these studies demonstrate that blind people can have veridical perceptions during OBEs associated with an NDE. Other investigations show that NDEs often result in deep psychological and spiritual changes.
These findings strongly challenge the mainstream neuroscientific view that mind and consciousness result solely from brain activity. As we have seen, such a view fails to account for how NDErs can experience—while their hearts are stopped—vivid and complex thoughts and acquire veridical information about objects or events remote from their bodies.
NDE studies also suggest that after physical death, mind and consciousness may continue in a transcendent level of reality that normally is not accessible to our senses and awareness. Needless to say, this view is utterly incompatible with the belief of many materialists that the material world is the only reality.
http://www.salon.com/2012/04/21/near_d ... singleton/
More on NDEs
More on NDEs
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Ivellious
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Re: More on NDEs
Not sure if I agree that these findings are "utterly incompatible" with non-religious neuroscientific ways of thinking. It doesn't seem out of the realm of possibility at all that during severe bodily stress (such as cardiac arrest) or other times where brain function is abnormal, that the brain could react in strange ways and a person could experience these types of images. I have a friend in neuroscience that said in a lot of ways it could be much like dreaming.
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moonstroller
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Re: More on NDEs
I had a NED experience when I was hit by a mortar round in Vietnam.
Almost the entire spectrum of reality we perceive, is rock hard, so to speak. We have detected life in abundance on this surface, that is to say, within the idea of Mass vs. Energy.
The idea that life or reality can exist completely as energy is only speculative. without any proof.
For life (intelligent life) to exist, it needs to be grounded in our hard surface reality, or so we consider. The idea that reality is transcendental (beyond ordinary or common experience) is still an open question and, as such, only a question. We cannot say that God exists in this transcendental state without knowing just what that state is except by faith alone.
The question of what is time/space has not been resolved and the question of whether or not God lives inside or outside of this time/space continuum has also not been resolved. It still remains an open question.
The idea of transcendentalism, in my opinion, should be considered second to this idea otherwise the idea of God is based entirely on faith, without solid considerations, which some offer as the only way you can consider God's existence, that is, by faith alone and not via science.
To my knowledge, ID (Intelligent Design) is the closest any avenue of religion has come to scientifically promoting the idea (via scientific evidence) that God is the real creator of life on our earth, but not necessarily the architect of reality.
Rather, ID proposes the idea that what we call God could be a super intelligence, living within our reality, that created life as we know it. The idea that this intelligence created reality still supports the idea that God lives outside of the reality that we are able to perceive. ID has failed to conceptually wield the idea that God, the creator of life, can be described via science.
NDE's tend to lie in the area of personal experience and are not ruled out by science but not supported by it either.
One important idea presented by ID is that electron micrographs have demonstrated that the flagellum of a bacterium, when examined closely totally resembles a motor with an encasement for support, and turns the flagellum to propel the organism within it's environment. That is: it is a nanomachine, not created by mankind nor evolution.
Throughout the years and centuries, science has given ID the only window to debate the possibility that we were created by something and did not actually evolve in a Darwinian sense. That is not to say that evolution is not a function of the creative motion but that this motion is helped along by some intelligence (God living within this reality along with us and asserting creative force, an alien super intelligence). Via this debate stratagem, it is possible to assume we were created by a super intelligent being(s), residing well within the realm of our reality, perhaps within our very own Universe. This creator(s) could also be alive and exerting some control over our day to day existence.
ID does not answer the question, does God exist separate from what we call reality and is responsibly for all creation. It doesn't even come close and because of this, the question is still retained by the domain of faith alone. It cannot be made palpable to anyone outside the realm of spiritualism who cannot accept faith alone.
The fact is, only by experiment can it be hope the question be resolved by science.
To debate using ethereal notions is to suffer from endless debate without resolution. Such work is done within the imagination of poets or, the lazy who know nothing about the labors of science. Theirs is the simple path of living life without question. The meek path.
If you live by faith, you die by faith and hopefully get your answer. But, if you live by science you still get your answer. We will know one way or the other.
Be good and be scientific and keep the possibility of God alive in the imaginations of human beings. That is the purpose of the Church. The manner of the church is to make the idea of God Palpable to the mind of man, that is, to keep it always in the imagination, not with fire and brimstone because that gives children nightmares but with love and compassion. God is not a God of fear but of love. The poets have no need of a book to keep the notion of God alive.
The power of faith lies in it's ability to give hope in a world of pain and suffering. Such hope has the power to heal and ease the pain of death; this has been proven and causes science to wonder (some call them miracles).
Faith resolves nothing and has no power to do so.
Science cannot dispute faith because science is locked in a room with it's tools and cannot see beyond the walls of that room which can only be widened by the tools of science, but, that room grows exponentially (sometimes)
.
Faith has nothing to prove leaving science to produce proof that the notions of faith are none existent.
God is not limited by notions of man. God is not limited. So says the poet.
John Ray
I think the whole issue revolves around the above statement. It's hard for us to consider that even though we can only perceive a minuet portion of the electromagnetic spectrum with our senses, there might be whole portions of reality we cannot perceive .NDE studies also suggest that after physical death, mind and consciousness may continue in a transcendent level of reality that normally is not accessible to our senses and awareness. Needless to say, this view is utterly incompatible with the belief of many materialists that the material world is the only reality.
Almost the entire spectrum of reality we perceive, is rock hard, so to speak. We have detected life in abundance on this surface, that is to say, within the idea of Mass vs. Energy.
The idea that life or reality can exist completely as energy is only speculative. without any proof.
For life (intelligent life) to exist, it needs to be grounded in our hard surface reality, or so we consider. The idea that reality is transcendental (beyond ordinary or common experience) is still an open question and, as such, only a question. We cannot say that God exists in this transcendental state without knowing just what that state is except by faith alone.
The question of what is time/space has not been resolved and the question of whether or not God lives inside or outside of this time/space continuum has also not been resolved. It still remains an open question.
The idea of transcendentalism, in my opinion, should be considered second to this idea otherwise the idea of God is based entirely on faith, without solid considerations, which some offer as the only way you can consider God's existence, that is, by faith alone and not via science.
To my knowledge, ID (Intelligent Design) is the closest any avenue of religion has come to scientifically promoting the idea (via scientific evidence) that God is the real creator of life on our earth, but not necessarily the architect of reality.
Rather, ID proposes the idea that what we call God could be a super intelligence, living within our reality, that created life as we know it. The idea that this intelligence created reality still supports the idea that God lives outside of the reality that we are able to perceive. ID has failed to conceptually wield the idea that God, the creator of life, can be described via science.
NDE's tend to lie in the area of personal experience and are not ruled out by science but not supported by it either.
One important idea presented by ID is that electron micrographs have demonstrated that the flagellum of a bacterium, when examined closely totally resembles a motor with an encasement for support, and turns the flagellum to propel the organism within it's environment. That is: it is a nanomachine, not created by mankind nor evolution.
Throughout the years and centuries, science has given ID the only window to debate the possibility that we were created by something and did not actually evolve in a Darwinian sense. That is not to say that evolution is not a function of the creative motion but that this motion is helped along by some intelligence (God living within this reality along with us and asserting creative force, an alien super intelligence). Via this debate stratagem, it is possible to assume we were created by a super intelligent being(s), residing well within the realm of our reality, perhaps within our very own Universe. This creator(s) could also be alive and exerting some control over our day to day existence.
ID does not answer the question, does God exist separate from what we call reality and is responsibly for all creation. It doesn't even come close and because of this, the question is still retained by the domain of faith alone. It cannot be made palpable to anyone outside the realm of spiritualism who cannot accept faith alone.
The fact is, only by experiment can it be hope the question be resolved by science.
To debate using ethereal notions is to suffer from endless debate without resolution. Such work is done within the imagination of poets or, the lazy who know nothing about the labors of science. Theirs is the simple path of living life without question. The meek path.
If you live by faith, you die by faith and hopefully get your answer. But, if you live by science you still get your answer. We will know one way or the other.
Be good and be scientific and keep the possibility of God alive in the imaginations of human beings. That is the purpose of the Church. The manner of the church is to make the idea of God Palpable to the mind of man, that is, to keep it always in the imagination, not with fire and brimstone because that gives children nightmares but with love and compassion. God is not a God of fear but of love. The poets have no need of a book to keep the notion of God alive.
The power of faith lies in it's ability to give hope in a world of pain and suffering. Such hope has the power to heal and ease the pain of death; this has been proven and causes science to wonder (some call them miracles).
Faith resolves nothing and has no power to do so.
Science cannot dispute faith because science is locked in a room with it's tools and cannot see beyond the walls of that room which can only be widened by the tools of science, but, that room grows exponentially (sometimes)
.Faith has nothing to prove leaving science to produce proof that the notions of faith are none existent.
God is not limited by notions of man. God is not limited. So says the poet.
John Ray