Once4all wrote:Yes, God's rest may be continuing since the 7th day; in fact, God's rest is the eternal rest for which we look forward to. However, nowhere does it say that the 7th day itself is going on and on and on and on.
It is true that we enter God's rest through Christ, and this passage appears to touch upon such a doctrine. Yet, God's rest being referred to in Hebrews is clearly analogous to God's rest on the seventh day of creation: '
"And on the seventh day God rested from all his work." And again in the passage above he says, "They shall never enter my rest."' It would make no sense to refer to God's seventh day of rest if it had ended. Therefore drawing the conclusion that the seventh day is open seems pretty clear to me, and it also seems it was evident to the early Church father Origen who wrote in the third century of the seventh (Sabbath) day lasting the full duration of the world:
He [Celsus] knows nothing of the day of the Sabbath and rest of God, which follows the completion of the world's creation, and which lasts during the duration of the world, and in which all those will keep festival with God who have done all their works in their six days, and who, because they have omitted none of their duties will ascend to the contemplation (of Celestial things) and to the assembly of righteous and blessed beings."
Once4all wrote:A few posts later, the discussion was about the past tense used in saying that God rest
ed on the 7th day. To which Kurieuo concluded:
So the past tense is in reference to when God first began resting from His creative works. This is the only way I can see to reconcile the two passages. God began resting in the past and still rests from His creation today.
Right. The past tense is used to indicate when God
began resting: on the 7th day. He has been restings since, but it does not follow from that that the 7th day has continued since. The 7th day is a reference in time to indicate when God's rest began.
You are correct that it does not
necessarily follow at least from Psalm 95:7-11 that the seventh day has not ended despite God's rest continuing. Yet as previously mentioned we are lead to believe in Hebrews that we are to enter God's seventh day of rest. And as pointed out by Mastermind, it is significant that the seventh day is never closed in Genesis. It certainly seems an obvious conclusion to draw from Scripture that God's seventh day was never closed.
Once4all wrote:In Hebrews 4:6,8, and 11 we can see that the writer is talking about the Promised Land as the place of rest to which the Israelistes were not permitted to enter. Just as the place of rest that we should be diligent to enter (Heb 4:11) is heaven.
You are correct to associate the rest with an eternal rest found in Christ. As is spoken of in Colossians 13-14, 16-17, the Sabbath finds its reality in Christ who gives all everlasting rest! Yet such meaning does not render God's seventh day of rest entirely irrelevant in the Hebrews passage. It would be hard to understand why the reference to God's seventh day of rest us in Hebrews 4 if it had ended.
Once4all wrote:Consider:
2Pe 3:4 and saying, "Where is the promise of His coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all continues just as it was from the beginning of creation."
Do you not realise that the meaning you attach to this passage is a double-edged sword and would also argue against the YEC view? The first thing I'd like to point out is that this verse does
not say mankind was at the very beginning of creation. As Adam and Eve were not created until day six, such would also argue against a young-earth view.
I'd also like to refer to Matthew Henry's commentary to help with an overview of this passage:
... here, say they, “The fathers have fallen asleep, those are all dead to whom the promise was made, and it was never made good in their time, and there is no likelihood that it ever will be in any time; why should we trouble ourselves about it? If there had been any truth or certainty in the promise you speak of, we should surely have seen somewhat of it before this time, some signs of his coming, some preparatory steps in order to it; whereas we find to this very day all things continue as they were, without any change, even from the beginning of the creation. Since the world has undergone no changes in the course of so many thousand years, why should we affright ourselves as if it were to have an end?” Thus do these scoffers argue. Because they see no changes, therefore they fear not God, Psa_55:19. They neither fear him nor his judgments; what he never has done they would conclude he never can do or never will.
Now since mankind was created on day six
and the fathers had fallen asleep (who do you think these father
s are?), none of these in their lifetime witnessed God's return. Everything appears to continue day after day like every other day since the beginning of creation. Many have died to whom Christ's return had been promised, and God doesn't seem to be letting us know what is going on, and so many scoff at such a promise. However, eventually the day will come just like in Noah's time, and when that day comes judgement will occur...
This passage has absolutely no impact upon the length of days.
Once4all wrote:I think an old earth creation belief diminishes God's glory.
That's fine, as I think a young earth interpretation diminishes God's glory and goes against Scripture which says:
- Psalm 19—
1 The heavens declare the glory of God;
the skies proclaim the work of his hands.
2 Day after day they pour forth speech;
night after night they display knowledge.
3 There is no speech or language
where their voice is not heard.
4 Their voice goes out into all the earth,
their words to the ends of the world.
Once4all wrote:God said he created the heavens and the earth and all that is in them in six days. That's what God wants us to believe. I believe it.
And I believe this too, however the issue is about what those days consist of.
Kurieuo.
) folks on both side of the fence.