The Comforter: Anyone know Greek?

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Christian2
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The Comforter: Anyone know Greek?

#1

Post by Christian2 » Wed Mar 16, 2005 8:22 am

I have a couple of questions about the Comforter.
"And I will pray the Father, and he will give you another Comforter, to be with you for ever, even the Spirit of Truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees him nor knows him; you know him, for he dwells with you, and will be in you". John 14.16-17.
"...and will be in you."

Does anyone know Greek? I am interested in the Greek word translated as "in." Does the Greek word actually mean literally "inside"?
"you know him, for he dwells with you"
What does "dwells with you" mean exactly? The Comforter is dwelling with the disciples--how is he dwelling with them? And Jesus says that His disciples "know him." How do they "know him"?
Nevertheless I tell you the truth. It is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send Him to you [John 16:7].
Notice that Jesus says "if I do not go away" and "but if I depart."

It sounds like there is a question in Jesus' mind that He might not have to depart. I thought of His prayer to the Father that the cup be removed, but John does not include this in His Gospel. What you think that Jesus means?

Thanks

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Mastermind
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#2

Post by Mastermind » Wed Mar 16, 2005 8:34 am

There is no question on whether He will depart. You simply misunderstand what he said. He's telling you what will happen if He would not be doing something the way He does it. It's like me about to go repair my tv and say "If I do not go repair my TV, it will blow up. There is no question on whether I'm going to go repair it, I am simply giving a statement of what the consequences would be if I do not do it.

Christian2
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OK, Mastermind

#3

Post by Christian2 » Thu Mar 17, 2005 6:25 am

I get your point.

Any thoughts on the rest of my questions?

Thanks.

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#4

Post by Mastermind » Thu Mar 17, 2005 7:27 am

No, I don't speak greek.

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Joel Freeman
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#5

Post by Joel Freeman » Thu Mar 17, 2005 9:26 pm

Mastermind wrote:No, I don't speak greek.
But do you KNOW it? That's the question at hand. :lol:
c2 wrote:What does "dwells with you" mean exactly? The Comforter is dwelling with the disciples--how is he dwelling with them? And Jesus says that His disciples "know him." How do they "know him"?
John Gill wrote:Joh 14:17 - Even the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, --- These words explain who is meant by the Comforter, "even the Spirit of truth"; the true Spirit of God, the dictator of the Scriptures of truth, who leads men into the truths of the Gospel, confirms them in them, and gives boldness and freedom to own, and confess them before men:

whom the world cannot receive;---- the men of the world, who are as they came into the world, carnal and natural men, can neither receive the Spirit nor the things of the Spirit, the truths and doctrines of the Gospel; they can neither receive them into their understandings, nor into their affections; and indeed, because they cannot understand them, therefore they do not love them, but despise and hate them:

because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him; ----- the world, and the men of it, can neither see him with their bodily eyes, because he is a "spirit"; nor know him with their understandings, because he is the "Spirit of truth", which they are ignorant of, for want of a spiritual discerning.

But ye know him; ----- as a spirit of illumination, regeneration, and conversion:

for he dwelleth with you; ------ he is an inhabitant in your hearts, he has taken up his residence in you as his temples:

and shall be in you; ------- as a Comforter, when I am gone from you; and as a spirit of truth to guide you into all truth, to stand by you, and assist you in preaching it, and to enable you to bear a faithful and glorious testimony for it.
Hope that helps.

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Mastermind
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#6

Post by Mastermind » Thu Mar 17, 2005 9:30 pm

Use your inductive reasoning to figure out if I know greek. :roll:

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Joel Freeman
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#7

Post by Joel Freeman » Thu Mar 17, 2005 9:31 pm

...so you do? :shock: This is not a serious post.

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Mastermind
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#8

Post by Mastermind » Thu Mar 17, 2005 9:34 pm

In common speech, when one says he does not speak Greek, it means one knows pretty much nothing about it. -___-

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Joel Freeman
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#9

Post by Joel Freeman » Thu Mar 17, 2005 9:35 pm

Highlight that last post of mine. :D

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Mastermind
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#10

Post by Mastermind » Thu Mar 17, 2005 9:44 pm

Very funny

Christian2
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Joel Freeman, thank you

#11

Post by Christian2 » Sat Mar 19, 2005 5:37 am

Hi Joel Freeman,

Yes, your input helps.

As far as the Greek, I guess I need to hear from someone who has the Greek New Testament and can translate the Greek into English as far as "and shall be in you" is concerned.

Thanks again.

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Re: The Comforter: Anyone know Greek?

#12

Post by sandy_mcd » Sun Mar 20, 2005 4:27 pm

Christian2 wrote:
"...and will be in you."

Does anyone know Greek? I am interested in the Greek word translated as "in." Does the Greek word actually mean literally "inside"?
No, but if you hum a few bars, I'll fake it.

The Greek phrase is καὶ ἐν ὑμῖν ἔσται - kai (and) en (in) 'umin (you) estai (he will be). En is a common preposition and presumably has about as many meanings as "in" in English. See, e.g., http://www.biblestudytools.net/Lexicons ... ersion=kjv .
You can check out this neat side-by-side English-Greek version of John 14 (as well as other chapters), look up occurrences of ἐν, and see the English context on the other side: http://www.ellopos.net/elpenor/greek-te ... ohn/14.asp .

Others have explained the logical 'if' of 16:7.

sandy

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#13

Post by sandy_mcd » Sun Mar 20, 2005 4:32 pm

Mastermind wrote:In common speech, when one says he does not speak Greek, it means one knows pretty much nothing about it. -___-
OTOH, in common speech, when one says 'Sounds like Greek to me', it also means one knows pretty much nothing about it.

sandy

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