Christmas

[PaulSacramento]

It's only around the corner !

Christmas is near and it is just a matter of time (if not already started) when the old and rehashed and many times over disproved views that Christmas is pagan will be coming around again.
The usual stuff:
Saturnalia
Sol Ivectus
Jesus was NOT born on December 25th and so forth.

Was wondering if it might be good to have a thread to address all that, thoughts?

[1over137]

Would be good reading for me.

[RickD]

Christmas as celebrated in the US, is nothing but a Christianized pagan holiday. Bah humbug!!!!

[PaulSacramento]

Christmas as celebrated in the US, is nothing but a Christianized pagan holiday. Bah humbug!!!!

Mr. Grouchypants

[PaulSacramento]

This one is detailed:
http://www.dec25th.info/

Another:
http://www.traditioninaction.org/religi ... igins.html

[PaulSacramento]

An interesting article about the Christmas tree:
http://chalcedon.edu/research/articles/ ... as-tree-2/

[B. W.]

Christmas as celebrated in the US, is nothing but a Christianized pagan holiday. Bah humbug!!!!

Dag gone it - got to buy presents and avoid the guilt of not buying presents...

So if I get Rick nothing for Christmas, he will repackage it and give it back to me and, wala, problem solved!
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[RickD]

Christmas as celebrated in the US, is nothing but a Christianized pagan holiday. Bah humbug!!!!

Dag gone it - got to buy presents and avoid the guilt of not buying presents...

So if I get Rick nothing for Christmas, he will repackage it and give it back to me and, wala, problem solved!
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-
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I hear ya B. W. I hate the feeling that I "need" to give a gift, because that's what Christmas is turning into. I love Christmas. I love the season. I love the decorations, the lights, the festive atmosphere. I just don't like the feeling of being obligated to give gifts just for the sake of giving gifts.

[1over137]

Christmas as celebrated in the US, is nothing but a Christianized pagan holiday. Bah humbug!!!!

Dag gone it - got to buy presents and avoid the guilt of not buying presents...

So if I get Rick nothing for Christmas, he will repackage it and give it back to me and, wala, problem solved!
-
-
-

I hear ya B. W. I hate the feeling that I "need" to give a gift, because that's what Christmas is turning into. I love Christmas. I love the season. I love the decorations, the lights, the festive atmosphere. I just don't like the feeling of being obligated to give gifts just for the sake of giving gifts.

ditto

[RickD]

Just got this in my email:

http://www.gotquestions.org/QOTW.htm

Question: "Was Jesus born on December 25? Is December 25 Jesus' birthday?"


Answer: Speculation as to the time of Jesus’ birth dates back to the 3rd century, when Hyppolytus (ca. 170-236) claimed that Jesus was born on December 25. The earliest mention of some sort of observance on that date is in the Philoclian Calendar, representing Roman practice, of the year 336. Later, John Chrysostom favored the same date of birth. Cyril of Jerusalem (348-386) had access to the original Roman birth census, which also documented that Jesus was born on the 25th of December. The date eventually became the officially recognized date for Christmas in part because it coincided with the pagan festivals celebrating Saturnalia and the winter solstice. The church thereby offered people a Christian alternative to the pagan festivities and eventually reinterpreted many of their symbols and actions in ways acceptable to Christian faith and practice.

December 25 has become more and more acceptable as the birth date of Jesus. However, some argue that the birth occurred in some other season, such as in the fall. Followers of this theory claim that the Judean winters were too cold for shepherds to be watching their flocks by night. History proves otherwise, however, and we have historical evidence that unblemished lambs for the Temple sacrifice were in fact kept in the fields near Bethlehem during the winter months. With that said, it is impossible to prove whether or not Jesus was born on December 25. And, ultimately, it does not matter.

The truth is we simply don’t know the exact date of our Savior’s birth. In fact, we don’t even know for sure the year in which He was born. Scholars believe it was somewhere between 6 B.C. and 4 B.C. One thing is clear: if God felt it was important for us to know the exact date of the Savior’s birth, He certainly would have told us in His Word. The Gospel of Luke gives very specific details about the event, even down to what the baby was wearing – “swaddling clothes”—and where he slept—“in a manger” (Luke 2:12). These details are important because they speak of His nature and character, meek and lowly. But the exact date of His birth has no significance whatsoever, which may be why God chose not to mention it.

The fact is that He was born, that He came into the world to atone for our sins, that He was resurrected to eternal life, and that He’s alive today. This is what we should celebrate, as we are told in the Old Testament in such passages as Zechariah 2:10: “'Shout and be glad, O Daughter of Zion. For I am coming, and I will live among you,' declares the LORD.” Further, the angel that announced the birth to the shepherds brought “good news of great joy that will be for all the people” (Luke 2:10). Surely here is the cause for celebration every day, not just once a year.

[Kurieuo]

It's only around the corner !

Christmas is near and it is just a matter of time (if not already started) when the old and rehashed and many times over disproved views that Christmas is pagan will be coming around again.
The usual stuff:
Saturnalia
Sol Ivectus
Jesus was NOT born on December 25th and so forth.

Was wondering if it might be good to have a thread to address all that, thoughts?

Well, since it's that time of year again, I thought these two videos might be good food for thought to Christians who even might accept Christmas is pagan:

1. Christmas is Not Pagan: Scripture

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ca_Yx3aMCiE

2. Christmas is not Pagan (History)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfcvJWPTY64

PS. Merry Christmas everyone!

[IceMobster]

Christmas and the time before it is heavily influenced by consumerism. It's sickening.

As for the 25th of December being the date of Jesus' birth, it doesn't really matter. What does matter is that it happened, now, the fact that the true date of his birth got lost in time is of secondary nature, really.

[abelcainsbrother]

I agree. It does not matter if December the 25th is not the real date of Jesus's birthday. Jesus is not mad at us for celebrating his birthday,he is glad we are. It is those who don't want to celebrate his birthday,the day he was born into this world, that has the problem.

[Nessa]

What if Jesus is really greedy and wants us to find out the real date so he can have two birthdays a year

The queen gets two birthdays a year... Actual birth date: 21st April yet in NZ, we always get a public holiday in June 'Queen's birthday'.

Greedy lady

[crochet1949]

It has been said that IF we Did know the exact date of Christ's birth -- there would be a tendency to worship the Date and not the Event. Like -- there are those who have a great family Bible and put it in a place on honor in their home -- but they Never open it up and Read it. They might even use it to store important family papers --but don't open it to Read it.

Yet -- Christmas is when Jesus Christ Did come into this world -- 'God with us'. A tremendous event in history -- His death on the cross and His bodily Resurrection is really the Main event. Without the 1st event -- there wouldn't be the 2nd event.

And the gifts giving -- the example given by the shepherds who brought gift to the Christ child. The principle is Wonderful -- the monetary gift extravagance is crazy. Why do parents go 'all out' for their kids' and feel they Have to get The Perfect gift -- the Most Popular 'whatever'. Maybe we Could try sitting down with our kids and reading to them. Baking cookies together. Simple family stuff.