There is plenty of Scripture that show Jesus is a distinct person from the Father, but they do not show that He isn't homoousios with the Father (shares in the same divine "essence").Mazzy wrote:There is a plethora of scriptures I can quote that demonstrates Jesus is not God. You have one that is very likely translated incorrectly.
Many of your quotes passages (found below) are being wrongly understood, based upon a misunderstanding as to the nature of differences. John 14:28 for example, where Jesus says that, "the Father being greater than I am." Surely, it doesn't surprise you to know many who believe in Christ's Divinity, fully accept Christ's statement here. We do distinguish different roles and functions, different processions, that appear unique to each person who are homoousios (same "essence") that is Divine -- God Himself, the Great I AM.
So we who embrace a Christology that says Jesus is both fully human and fully divine, understand it's not that Christ's essence differs, but rather His role and function especially as God incarnated Himself in human form to do what we, nor any other creature, could rightly do for us. God's covenant with Israel was between Him and Abraham and taken up by Israel who God selected to be the people through whom He would reveal Himself, offering forgiveness and redemption to all humanity.
As the Apostle Paul explains (paraphrasing), "Christ, who being God in His very nature, considered it not robbery to be equal to God." (Phil 2:5-6) Strange passage isn't it? Why would anyone on earth think Jesus was robbed of being equal to God, unless Jesus was indeed of the same "essence" (homoousios) to God. Further, consider it a given for a second that Jesus was actually in His very nature God. Can God no longer be God? No. Therefore Jesus in taking upon Himself human form, still must have remained in His very nature God.
Then we come to Phil 2:7-8 which gets to the heart of many misunderstandings in the passages you cite, and others like JWs, Muslims and anyone who thinks Jesus was a created being, a creature of God, even if the first of all creation:
- "But [Jesus] made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross."
I'd also recommend this video here, which responds to John 14:28 and essentially covers what I've been here saying. With a correct understanding of what is meant in this passage, how Christ is unique from the Father, yet shared in the same divine essence (again homoousios was the official term which won agreement), then through this lens all your Scripture below becomes understood in correct light and poses no issue to those who believe Christ is God.
Note: No one denies Jesus doesn't differ from the Father (which is what many of your passages support), but rather it is the how in which Jesus differs from the Father that we disagree. You must prove that Christ differs in His divine essence, rather than merely role, function, or even divine entitlements (which the Father restored when placing Jesus' name above EVERY OTHER NAME to be worshiped as the Lord by ALL in heaven and on earth (Phil 2:9-10) -- that would include Jehovah, only if Jesus were not one and the same.Mazzy wrote:1. Matthew 24:36
No one knows about that day or hour, not even the Son, but the Father only.
Here Jesus makes a distinction between what he knows and what the Father knows.
2. Matthew 26:39
My Father, if it is possible, may this cup be taken from me, yet not as I will, but as Thou will.
Jesus’ will is likewise autonomous from God’s Will. Jesus is seeking acquiescence to God’s will.
3. John 5:26
For as the Father has life in Himself, so he has granted the Son to have life in himself.
Jesus received his life from God. God received his life from no one. He is eternally self-existent.
4. John 5:30
By myself, I can do nothing: I judge only as I hear, and my judgment is just, for I seek not to please myself but him who has sent me.
Jesus says, “by myself, I can do nothing.” This indicates that Jesus is relying upon his own relationship with God. He is not trying to “please myself” but rather is seeking to “please the one who sent me.”
5. John 5:19
The Son can do nothing by himself; he can do only what he sees the Father doing, because whatever the Father does, the Son does also.
Jesus declares that he is following a pattern laid down by God. He is expressing obedience to God.
6. Mark 10:18
Why do you call me good? No one is good, except God alone.
Here Jesus emphatically makes a distinction between himself and God.
7. John 14:28
The Father is greater than I.
This is another strong statement that makes a distinction between Jesus and God.
8. Matthew 6:9
Our Father, which art in Heaven.
He didn’t pray, Our Father, which art standing right here!”
9. Matthew 27:46
My God, My God, why hast thou forsaken me?
Inconceivable if he is God the Creator.
10. John 17:21-23
. . .that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me. . ..that they may be one as we are one: I in them and you in me.
In this prayer Jesus defines the term “to be one.” It is clearly accomplished through the relationship of two autonomous beings. Christian believers are to model their relationship (to become one) after the relationship of God and Christ (as God and Christ are one). Notice that “to be one” does not mean to be “one and the same.”
11. 1 Corinthians 15:27-28
For he "has put everything under his feet." Now when it says that "everything" has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ. When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all.
Paul declares that God put everything under Christ, except God himself. Instead God rules all things through Christ. (remember: “through him all things were made.”)
12. Hebrews 1:3
The Son is the radiance of God’s glory and the exact representation of his being.
Jesus is the exact representation of his being. I send my representative to Congress. He is not me, myself. He is my representative.
13. Hebrews 4:15 (compared with James 1:13)
For we do not have a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are—yet without sin. Jesus has been tempted in every way, just as we are, yet he never sinned. See
14. Hebrews 5:7-9
During the days of Jesus' life on earth, he offered up prayers and petitions with loud cries and tears to the one who could save him from death, and he was heard because of his reverent submission. Although he was a son, he learned obedience from what he suffered and, once made perfect, he became the source of eternal salvation for all who obey him
Jesus had to walk a course of faith and obedience in order to achieve perfection. By achieving perfection, Jesus “became” the source of eternal salvation
As for a handful of other passages not covered by a correct understanding of the Son's differences to the Father (e.g., Hebrews 1:3 , John 17:21-23), indeed such support Christ's divinity. I'm puzzled why you quote them, since these should really highlight that it isn't Christ's divine nature that differs (Christ is an exact representation of, and being one with, God), but rather it was as Paul explains in Philippians 2, Christ who being in His very nature God not considering it robbery to make Himself lesser than the Father while being found in human form.