Dark Matter and the big bang

Discussion about scientific issues as they relate to God and Christianity including archaeology, origins of life, the universe, intelligent design, evolution, etc.
User avatar
Silvertusk
Board Moderator
Posts: 1952
Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2005 5:38 am
Christian: Yes
Sex: Male
Creation Position: Undecided
Location: United Kingdom
Has liked: 8 times
Been liked: 24 times

Dark Matter and the big bang

#1

Post by Silvertusk » Thu Nov 24, 2005 2:07 am

Hi guys

I have just read an article on the Big Bang and how dark matter is causing problems with the theory.

"Not only has it revealed that dark energy is the most powerful driving force in the expansion of the cosmos, but also most of it is made up of a completely unknown form of matter......Big Bang theory suggests that all matter was created in a single explosion, the emergence of matter not created in this fashion presents a serious problem."
(Metro Newspaper November 24th)

Has anyone any ideas how this might fit in within our world view of God creating the universe. Because current thinking is that this dark energy literally emerges from empty space and this is causing the expansion rate to accelerate.

God Bless

Silvertusk

User avatar
Silvertusk
Board Moderator
Posts: 1952
Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2005 5:38 am
Christian: Yes
Sex: Male
Creation Position: Undecided
Location: United Kingdom
Has liked: 8 times
Been liked: 24 times

#2

Post by Silvertusk » Thu Nov 24, 2005 2:31 am

Also.

Why is it that Atheists are searching for this Dark matter. If it exists and it is the driving force of the accelerated expansion of the universe - How does that rule out God? Wouldn't that just be the tool that God is using to expand the universe anyway?

Questions questions......

God Bless

Silvertusk

User avatar
Believer
Advanced Senior Member
Posts: 780
Joined: Sat Mar 05, 2005 7:44 pm
Christian: No
Location: Oregon
Has liked: 0
Been liked: 0

#3

Post by Believer » Thu Nov 24, 2005 3:19 am

Silvertusk wrote:Also.

Why is it that Atheists are searching for this Dark matter. If it exists and it is the driving force of the accelerated expansion of the universe - How does that rule out God? Wouldn't that just be the tool that God is using to expand the universe anyway?

Questions questions......

God Bless

Silvertusk
Yes, it is a tool from God. Science, once again, explains the "hows" which are still limited, while they cannot really explain the "whys". Don't worry about it, seriously, please don't. A relationship with God/Jesus is more important than a relationship with science.

User avatar
Silvertusk
Board Moderator
Posts: 1952
Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2005 5:38 am
Christian: Yes
Sex: Male
Creation Position: Undecided
Location: United Kingdom
Has liked: 8 times
Been liked: 24 times

#4

Post by Silvertusk » Thu Nov 24, 2005 4:58 am

Thanks Thinker.

I was just wondering why athiests are so adamant to prove that Dark matter exists. Other Apologetics sites seem to hate the idea of Dark Matter/ Dark Energy. I don't understand the reasoning behind it. If there is Dark matter, the universe still has a beginning - that hasn't changed - The only thing that might have changed is the fact that Dark matter is expanding the universe and not the initial Big Bang.

Anyone own a laymans book on the universe I can borrow :)

God Bless

Silvertusk

SpaceCase
Familiar Member
Posts: 34
Joined: Fri Oct 14, 2005 2:27 pm
Christian: No
Location: New Jersey
Has liked: 0
Been liked: 0

#5

Post by SpaceCase » Thu Nov 24, 2005 8:27 am

Silvertusk wrote:Anyone own a laymans book on the universe I can borrow :)
Awesome! (lmao)

I haven't read that much about dark matter, I assumed everything came from the big bang, including dark matter. Does the article say why they think it has appeared since? Or are there other links that do?

just curious...

User avatar
BGoodForGoodSake
Ultimate Member
Posts: 2125
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2005 9:44 am
Christian: No
Location: Washington D.C.
Has liked: 28 times
Been liked: 12 times

#6

Post by BGoodForGoodSake » Thu Nov 24, 2005 9:33 am

SpaceCase wrote:
Silvertusk wrote:Anyone own a laymans book on the universe I can borrow :)
Awesome! (lmao)

I haven't read that much about dark matter, I assumed everything came from the big bang, including dark matter. Does the article say why they think it has appeared since? Or are there other links that do?

just curious...
What is meant by dark matter is that there is something out there adding to gravitational forces but cannot be detected. Dark energy is some sort of force which speeds up expansion. These were theorized because the expansion of the Universe seems to be accelerating. The reason scientists want to find it is because first and foremost it will test the theory. Second if true there could be practical implications.

Everything is still thought to have expanded from a singularity.
It is not length of life, but depth of life. -- Ralph Waldo Emerson

User avatar
Silvertusk
Board Moderator
Posts: 1952
Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2005 5:38 am
Christian: Yes
Sex: Male
Creation Position: Undecided
Location: United Kingdom
Has liked: 8 times
Been liked: 24 times

#7

Post by Silvertusk » Thu Nov 24, 2005 11:33 am

Thanks Guys

This is what I thought - but the way some apologetics sites go on about it, is sounds like something we theists should be afraid of.

The fact that we still come from a singularity is still pretty much accepted, you are right.

God bless

Silvertusk

User avatar
Silvertusk
Board Moderator
Posts: 1952
Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2005 5:38 am
Christian: Yes
Sex: Male
Creation Position: Undecided
Location: United Kingdom
Has liked: 8 times
Been liked: 24 times

#8

Post by Silvertusk » Thu Nov 24, 2005 11:35 am

SpaceCase wrote:
Silvertusk wrote:Anyone own a laymans book on the universe I can borrow :)
Awesome! (lmao)

I haven't read that much about dark matter, I assumed everything came from the big bang, including dark matter. Does the article say why they think it has appeared since? Or are there other links that do?

just curious...
The article suggested that the Dark Matter did not come from the big bang itself where it was once thought all matter did.

God Bless

Silvertusk

Jbuza
Esteemed Senior Member
Posts: 1213
Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2005 5:26 pm
Has liked: 0
Been liked: 0

#9

Post by Jbuza » Thu Nov 24, 2005 9:38 pm

The thing is, is science just trying to investigate something non material from its materialistic philosophy? We call it Dark matter because we "know" that it "must" be matter in order to imapact the physical world. Perhaps it is the power of God and science cannot understand that from its commonly applied philosophy.

User avatar
BGoodForGoodSake
Ultimate Member
Posts: 2125
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2005 9:44 am
Christian: No
Location: Washington D.C.
Has liked: 28 times
Been liked: 12 times

#10

Post by BGoodForGoodSake » Thu Nov 24, 2005 11:45 pm

Jbuza wrote:The thing is, is science just trying to investigate something non material from its materialistic philosophy? We call it Dark matter because we "know" that it "must" be matter in order to imapact the physical world. Perhaps it is the power of God and science cannot understand that from its commonly applied philosophy.
So because you think this we should not even bother investigating?
Perhaps this is the case but are you certain?
It is not length of life, but depth of life. -- Ralph Waldo Emerson

User avatar
Silvertusk
Board Moderator
Posts: 1952
Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2005 5:38 am
Christian: Yes
Sex: Male
Creation Position: Undecided
Location: United Kingdom
Has liked: 8 times
Been liked: 24 times

#11

Post by Silvertusk » Fri Nov 25, 2005 4:19 am

Just found a few interesting quotes in the Bible (NIV)

Jude 1:13
They are wild waves of the sea, foaming up their shame; wandering stars, for whom blackest darkness has been reserved forever.

Matthew 25:30

And throw that worthless servant outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Isaiah 50:3
I clothe the sky with darkness and make sackcloth its covering."

These were mentioned in another apologectic site about the Bible talking about Dark Matter and Black Holes.


God Bless

Silvertusk

IRQ Conflict
Senior Member
Posts: 540
Joined: Sat Nov 19, 2005 5:01 pm
Christian: Yes
Sex: Male
Creation Position: Young-Earth Creationist
Location: AB. Canada
Has liked: 0
Been liked: 0

#12

Post by IRQ Conflict » Fri Nov 25, 2005 6:32 am

Isaiah 42:5

Thus says God Yahweh, he who created the heavens and stretched them out, he who spread out the earth and that which comes out of it, he who gives breath to its people and spirit to those who walk in it.

Interesting uh? ;)

Jbuza
Esteemed Senior Member
Posts: 1213
Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2005 5:26 pm
Has liked: 0
Been liked: 0

#13

Post by Jbuza » Fri Nov 25, 2005 6:35 am

BGoodForGoodSake wrote:
Jbuza wrote:The thing is, is science just trying to investigate something non material from its materialistic philosophy? We call it Dark matter because we "know" that it "must" be matter in order to imapact the physical world. Perhaps it is the power of God and science cannot understand that from its commonly applied philosophy.
So because you think this we should not even bother investigating?
Perhaps this is the case but are you certain?
Nope. I'm quite sure that man's curiosity will have him investigating everything he can think of for the rest of his time. I'm just saying it may be possible that it is difficult to explain because Science is convinced this additional force must be material. It is not outside the realm of possiblity that the force that contains things, that extra force needed is God. By all means I think science should continue investigating, but this special form of matter that we will just define as invisible matter that doesn't have the properties of matter is just a theory, and the observation is also explainable by theorizing that when God says all things by me consist, that that could mean that he is the "glue" that holds things together.

Just because someone theorized about some unknown kind of matter that seems to have some magical unknown properties different than matter doesn't mean it is true.

User avatar
BGoodForGoodSake
Ultimate Member
Posts: 2125
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2005 9:44 am
Christian: No
Location: Washington D.C.
Has liked: 28 times
Been liked: 12 times

#14

Post by BGoodForGoodSake » Fri Nov 25, 2005 9:10 am

Jbuza wrote:
BGoodForGoodSake wrote:
Jbuza wrote:The thing is, is science just trying to investigate something non material from its materialistic philosophy? We call it Dark matter because we "know" that it "must" be matter in order to imapact the physical world. Perhaps it is the power of God and science cannot understand that from its commonly applied philosophy.
So because you think this we should not even bother investigating?
Perhaps this is the case but are you certain?
Nope. I'm quite sure that man's curiosity will have him investigating everything he can think of for the rest of his time. I'm just saying it may be possible that it is difficult to explain because Science is convinced this additional force must be material. It is not outside the realm of possiblity that the force that contains things, that extra force needed is God. By all means I think science should continue investigating, but this special form of matter that we will just define as invisible matter that doesn't have the properties of matter is just a theory, and the observation is also explainable by theorizing that when God says all things by me consist, that that could mean that he is the "glue" that holds things together.

Just because someone theorized about some unknown kind of matter that seems to have some magical unknown properties different than matter doesn't mean it is true.
Noone has said it was true. It is only a hypothesis. Just as your theory is just a hypothesis. At this point all we have is "I don't know".
It is not length of life, but depth of life. -- Ralph Waldo Emerson

User avatar
Silvertusk
Board Moderator
Posts: 1952
Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2005 5:38 am
Christian: Yes
Sex: Male
Creation Position: Undecided
Location: United Kingdom
Has liked: 8 times
Been liked: 24 times

#15

Post by Silvertusk » Fri Nov 25, 2005 1:36 pm

IRQ Conflict wrote:Isaiah 42:5

Thus says God Yahweh, he who created the heavens and stretched them out, he who spread out the earth and that which comes out of it, he who gives breath to its people and spirit to those who walk in it.

Interesting uh? ;)
Yes I do like that one.

Not bad for a three thousand year old book. :)

Post Reply