Were the Nephilim and the Sumerian mythical kings somehow related?

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Re: Were the Nephilim and the Sumerian mythical kings somehow related?

#391

Post by DBowling » Thu Aug 24, 2017 9:41 am

PaulSacramento wrote:
RickD wrote:
PaulSacramento wrote:Does anyone care to address why the leader of the fallen angels, one banned from the Garden of Eden and cursed, would be allowed to be among the Sons of God in YHWH's heavenly assembly?
If you're talking about him in Job, the context shows why he was there. It's a story about Job. Satan was allowed access to Job, in order to show job's faithfulness.

Not that Satan was allowed access to Job, its that a fallen and cursed angel seems to be just waltzing in to God's assembly with God's Sons.
I'm not sure we can infer from the text that Satan has the same level of access to God that the "sons of God" do.
God is the initiator of the conversation with Satan, and I think it is reasonable to conclude that Satan's access to God required God's specific permission, and is not something that is 'normal' since this occurred after Satan was cast out of heaven.

my .02

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Re: Were the Nephilim and the Sumerian mythical kings somehow related?

#392

Post by PaulSacramento » Thu Aug 24, 2017 10:53 am

The thing is that it seems to appear like Satan has access to heaven and it's quite free.
Especially since it happens more than once.

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Re: Were the Nephilim and the Sumerian mythical kings somehow related?

#393

Post by B. W. » Thu Aug 24, 2017 11:12 am

+
Question: Where did the doctrines of the Sethites and the Human leader doctrine originate from?

These doctrines originate from what is now known as the Second Book of Adam and Eve also called the Book of Cave Treasures. The Second Book of Adam and Eve is classed as part of the "Pseudepigrapha" most likely written several hundred years before Jesus’ birth. It was a revered book and quoted in the Jewish Talmud, the Islamic Koran, as well as used heavily by Kabbalist - Jewish Mysticism, and used even in the occult to support the Lilith doctrine., and possibly shape shifting.

Later, during the Medieval era, Jewish scholars used it to derive variations that the “sons of God” mentioned in Gen 6:1-12 refer to human men who were the great leaders, rulers and not to angelic beings. Also, the early Christian writer, St Augustine, seems to have borrow heavily from it to develop the City of God concept and the Sethite doctrine which the 2 Book of Adam and Eve also supports.

This book Books of Adam and Eve contain contrary details to what the bible teaches. For example, it is here we first hear that the line of Seth as being called the ‘son’s of God’ due to their purity. This chapter explains that the Sethites lived on the mountain near the Cave of Treasure, while Cain’s cursed line lived on the plains.
2 Book of Adam and Eve CHAP. XI:3-4
http://www.sacred-texts.com/bib/fbe/fbe095.htm

3 And Seth the elder, tall and good, with a fine soul, and of a strong mind, stood at the head of his people; and tended them in innocence, penitence, and meekness, and did not allow one of them to go down to Cain's children. 4 But because of their own purity, they were named "Children of God," and they were with God, instead of the hosts of angels who fell; for they continued in praises to God, and in singing psalms unto Him, in their cave--the Cave of Treasures.

10 Seth and his children dwelt on the mountain below the garden; they sowed not, neither did they reap; they wrought no food for the body. not even wheat; but only offerings. They ate of the fruit and of trees well flavoured that grew on the mountain where they dwelt.11 Then Seth often fasted every forty days, as did also his eldest children. For the family of Seth smelled the smell of the trees in the garden, when the wind blew that way.
12 They were happy, innocent, without sudden fear, there was no jealousy, no evil action, no hatred among them. There was no animal passion; from no mouth among them went forth either foul words or curse; neither evil counsel nor fraud. For the men of that time never swore, but under hard circumstances, when men must swear, they swore by the blood of Abel the just.
13 But they constrained their children and their women every day in the cave to fast and pray, and to worship the most High God. They blessed themselves in the body of their father Adam, and anointed themselves with it.
14 And they did so until the end of Seth drew near.
Sethiites were viewed as pure in God’s sight. This does not match what Paul reveals in Romans 3:23 as well as Romans 5:12.

Nor does blessing themselves in the presence of the dead either is supported in the bible and anointing themselves with the dead. That practice is occultic. It is practiced today by occultist by laying on the grave sites of famous dead people, or shamans, to receive their power…

This next phrase is found in chapter four:
2 Book of Adam and Eve CHAP. IV:3-4
http://www.sacred-texts.com/bib/fbe/fbe088.htm

3 And God said to Adam, "Look at this devil, and at his hideous look, and know that he it is who made thee fall from brightness into darkness, from peace and rest to toil and misery. 4 And look, O Adam, at him, who said of himself that he is God! Can God be black? Would God take the form of a woman? Is there any one stronger than God? And can He be overpowered?”
Do you see how the underlined segment supposedly spoken by God violates Gen 1:26 as well as Rev 7:9?

So, you have an ancient text that makes out God as some sort of racist and mocker of women. Seriously, is this the book one should base the doctrine of the Sethites or Human Leaders doctrines as the ‘sons of God’ used in Gen 6:1-12 on?

Let us look at St Augustine’s work – City of God and look for correlation to the 2 Book of Adam and Eve.
Augustine City of God (Book XV)
http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/120115.htm

Having treated in the four preceding books of the origin of the two cities, the earthly and the heavenly, Augustine explains their growth and progress in the four books which follow; and, in order to do so, he explains the chief passages of the sacred history which bear upon this subject. In this fifteenth book he opens this part of his work by explaining the events recorded in Genesis from the time of Cain and Abel to the deluge.

Chapter 1.— Of the Two Lines of the Human Race Which from First to Last Divide It.

Of these two first parents of the human race, then, Cain was the first-born, and he belonged to the city of men; after him was born Abel, who belonged to the city of God. For as in the individual the truth of the apostle's…
Augustine, in his work, The City of God, you will discover that he warns about heavy use of allegory, and mystic interpretations. But, is not Augustine relying heavily the same format to buttress his concept of the two Cities of men which strangely mirrors his variation of the 2 Book of Adam and Eve, mountain race and the plains race of men?

Proof of what I just said below…
Augustine City of God (Book XV)
http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/120115.htm

Chapter 2.— Of the Children of the Flesh and the Children of the Promise.

There was indeed on earth, so long as it was needed, a symbol and foreshadowing image of this city, which served the purpose of reminding men that such a city was to be rather than of making it present; and this image was itself called the holy city, as a symbol of the future city, though not itself the reality.
In Chapters 8,9 etc, Augustine writes of Cain and his family tree and spins off into some hefty rabbit trails to build off of to support his view.
Book 15 continues -Chapter 17 — Of the Two Fathers and Leaders Who Sprang from One Progenitor.
http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/120115.htm

Since, then, Adam was the father of both lines—the father, that is to say, both of the line which belonged to the earthly, and of that which belonged to the heavenly city—when Abel was slain, and by his death exhibited a marvellous mystery, there were henceforth two lines proceeding from two fathers, Cain and Seth, and in those sons of theirs, whom it behooved to register, the tokens of these two cities began to appear more distinctly.

For Cain begot Enoch, in whose name he built a city, an earthly one, which was not from home in this world, but rested satisfied with its temporal peace and happiness. …

…Further, Seth signifies resurrection, and Enos his son signifies man, not as Adam, which also signifies man, but is used in Hebrew indifferently for man and woman…

…Wherefore I think it not immaterial to observe that in those generations which are propagated from him who is called Seth, although daughters as well as sons are said to have been begotten, no woman is expressly registered by name; but in those which sprang from Cain at the very termination to which the line runs, the last person named as begotten is a woman….

…. Whereby it is elegantly signified that the earthly city shall to its termination have carnal generations proceeding from the intercourse of males and females. And therefore, the wives themselves of the man who is the last named father of Cain's line, are registered in their own names—a practice nowhere followed before the deluge save in Eve's case. Now as Cain, signifying possession, the founder of the earthly city, and his son Enoch, meaning dedication, in whose name it was founded, indicate that this city is earthly both in its beginning and in its end—a city in which nothing more is hoped for than can be seen in this world—

….so Seth, meaning resurrection, and being the father of generations registered apart from the others, we must consider what this sacred history says of his son.
You have two groups, two cities, not much different that what is found in the Books of Adam and Eve.
Book 15 continues - Chapter 22.— Of the Fall of the Sons of God Who Were Captivated by the Daughters of Men, Whereby All, with the Exception of Eight Persons, Deservedly Perished in the Deluge.

When the human race, in the exercise of this freedom of will, increased and advanced, there arose a mixture and confusion of the two cities by their participation in a common iniquity. And this calamity, as well as the first, was occasioned by woman, though not in the same way; for these women were not themselves betrayed, neither did they persuade the men to sin, but having belonged to the earthly city and society of the earthly, they had been of corrupt manners from the first, and were loved for their bodily beauty by the sons of God, or the citizens of the other city which sojourns in this world.
Does this sound familiar to the book of 2 Adam and Eve?

Next, in the City of God book 15, Augustine goes on rabbit trails to support that angelic beings are not what is implied in Genesis 6:1-12.
Book 15 continues - Chapter 23—
http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/120115.htm

Whether We are to Believe that Angels, Who are of a Spiritual Substance, Fell in Love with the Beauty of Women, and Sought Them in Marriage, and that from This Connection Giants Were Born.

In the third book of this work (c. 5) we made a passing reference to this question, but did not decide whether angels, in as much as they are spirits, could have bodily intercourse with women…

For the Greek word ἄγγελος, which in Latin appears as angelus, means a messenger….

From these assertions, indeed, I dare not determine whether there be some spirits embodied in an aerial substance (for this element, even when agitated by a fan, is sensibly felt by the body), and who are capable of lust and of mingling sensibly with women; but certainly I could by no means believe that God's holy angels could at that time have so fallen, nor can I think that it is of them the Apostle Peter said, For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment. 2 Peter 2:4

I think he rather speaks of these who first apostatized from God, along with their chief the devil, who enviously deceived the first man under the form of a serpent.

…But the same holy Scripture affords the most ample testimony that even godly men have been called angels; for of John it is written: Behold, I send my messenger (angel) before Your face, who shall prepare Your way. Mark 1:2 And the prophet Malachi, by a peculiar grace specially communicated to him, was called an angel. Malachi 2:7

…Giants therefore might well be born, even before the sons of God, who are also called angels of God, formed a connection with the daughters of men, or of those living according to men, that is to say, before the sons of Seth formed a connection with the daughters of Cain…

But some are moved by the fact that we have read that the fruit of the connection between those who are called angels of God and the women they loved were not men like our own breed, but giants; just as if there were not born even in our own time (as I have mentioned above) men of much greater size than the ordinary stature. Was there not at Rome a few years ago, when the destruction of the city now accomplished by the Goths was drawing near, a woman, with her father and mother, who by her gigantic size over-topped all others? Surprising crowds from all quarters came to see her, and that which struck them most was the circumstance that neither of her parents were quite up to the tallest ordinary stature….

…Giants therefore might well be born, even before the sons of God, who are also called angels of God, formed a connection with the daughters of men, or of those living according to men, that is to say, before the sons of Seth formed a connection with the daughters of Cain.
Further in Chapter 23, City of God, much of the same argument used nowadays is mirrored in both the modern Sethite and human Leader doctrines. Augustine sates not to rely on use apocryphal, sources, but did he not use the 2 Book of Adam and Eve to derive his…

Two separate races of humanity and through sex, the pure race of Cain was corrupted by Cain’s line?

Come on… is it really only about sex or the sin nature which by the way, corrupted all humanity, including Seth's line as well. If not then how can the writings on the subject of how sin entered the world affecting all humanity mentioned in the New Testament be true?
Book 15 Continues - Chapter 23…
http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/120115.htm

But that those angels were not angels in the sense of not being men, as some suppose,

Let us omit, then, the fables of those scriptures which are called apocryphal, because their obscure origin was unknown to the fathers from whom the authority of the true Scriptures has been transmitted to us by a most certain and well-ascertained succession. For though there is some truth in these apocryphal writings, yet they contain so many false statements, that they have no canonical authority

There is therefore no doubt that, according to the Hebrew and Christian canonical Scriptures, there were many giants before the deluge, and that these were citizens of the earthly society of men, and that the sons of God, who were according to the flesh the sons of Seth, sunk into this community when they forsook righteousness.
Back in Book XIV - The City of God – Augustine states the same themes mirrored in the 2nd Book of Adam and Eve but used the allegory of Cities instead a mountain and flat lands. He uses the same story line, as well, as twist the bible according to his view on predestination as The City of God Book XIV laboriously spins off into..
The City of God, Augustine, (Book XIV) Chapter 28.— Of the Nature of the Two Cities, the Earthly and the Heavenly.

Accordingly, two cities have been formed by two loves: the earthly by the love of self, even to the contempt of God; the heavenly by the love of God, even to the contempt of self…
Conclusion:

So, what is being presented here is evidence that the Sethite and Human Leader doctrines concerning the son’s of God mentions in Gen 6:1-12, came not as inspired from the bible but rather from an well-known ancient apocryphal Jewish source which is today known as the Books of Adam and Eve, or The Cave Treasures.

Books mind you used by Jewish Mystic Kabbalist with scriptural errors too numerous to list here.

If the book of Enoch, Josephus, Philo, Book of Jasher, Jude and Peters Letters as well as the fragments found in the Dead Sea Scrolls cannot be used either, then, the same rule must apply to Augustine’s work and the Books of Adam and Eve from which the doctrines of the Sethite and human leader point of view originates from...

Now we are back to square one.
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Re: Were the Nephilim and the Sumerian mythical kings somehow related?

#394

Post by DBowling » Thu Aug 24, 2017 11:41 am

PaulSacramento wrote:The thing is that it seems to appear like Satan has access to heaven and it's quite free.
Especially since it happens more than once.
I'm not sure I agree...
Where else in Scripture (other than Job) do we see the fallen Satan in heaven?
The Job situation appears to be a specific case dealing with Job as opposed to a typical situation.

I just don't think Scripture speaks to how often and under what circumstances Satan has access to heaven, so I 'assume' that being cast out of heaven means that Satan no longer has free access to heaven.

my .02

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Re: Were the Nephilim and the Sumerian mythical kings somehow related?

#395

Post by DBowling » Thu Aug 24, 2017 11:51 am

B. W. wrote:+
Conclusion:

So, what is being presented here is evidence that the Sethite and Human Leader doctrines concerning the son’s of God mentions in Gen 6:1-12, came not as inspired from the bible but rather from an well-known ancient apocryphal Jewish source which is today known as the Books of Adam and Eve, or The Cave Treasures.

Books mind you used by Jewish Mystic Kabbalist with scriptural errors too numerous to list here.

If the book of Enoch, Josephus, Philo, Book of Jasher, Jude and Peters Letters as well as the fragments found in the Dead Sea Scrolls cannot be used either, then, the same rule must apply to Augustine’s work and the Books of Adam and Eve from which the doctrines of the Sethite and human leader point of view originates from...

Now we are back to square one.
Which means that if we want to understand what Scripture means when it uses the phrase "sons of God" in Genesis 6, then it makes sense to make like the Bereans and focus on how Scripture uses the phrase "sons of God" instead of relying on any extrascriptural traditions which lead to a definition that is inconsistent with what Jesus says in John 8.
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Re: Were the Nephilim and the Sumerian mythical kings somehow related?

#396

Post by RickD » Thu Aug 24, 2017 12:04 pm

DBowling wrote:
B. W. wrote:+
Conclusion:

So, what is being presented here is evidence that the Sethite and Human Leader doctrines concerning the son’s of God mentions in Gen 6:1-12, came not as inspired from the bible but rather from an well-known ancient apocryphal Jewish source which is today known as the Books of Adam and Eve, or The Cave Treasures.

Books mind you used by Jewish Mystic Kabbalist with scriptural errors too numerous to list here.

If the book of Enoch, Josephus, Philo, Book of Jasher, Jude and Peters Letters as well as the fragments found in the Dead Sea Scrolls cannot be used either, then, the same rule must apply to Augustine’s work and the Books of Adam and Eve from which the doctrines of the Sethite and human leader point of view originates from...

Now we are back to square one.
Which means that if we want to understand what Scripture means when it uses the phrase "sons of God" in Genesis 6, then it makes sense to make like the Bereans and focus on how Scripture uses the phrase "sons of God" instead of relying on any extrascriptural traditions which lead to a definition that is inconsistent with what Jesus says in John 8.
I feel like I'm beating a dead horse, but where does scripture use the term "sons of God" to refer to fallen angels? Scripture simply does not. There's no avoiding that.
1 Corinthians 1:9
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Re: Were the Nephilim and the Sumerian mythical kings somehow related?

#397

Post by RickD » Thu Aug 24, 2017 12:06 pm

PaulSacramento wrote:
RickD wrote:
PaulSacramento wrote:Does anyone care to address why the leader of the fallen angels, one banned from the Garden of Eden and cursed, would be allowed to be among the Sons of God in YHWH's heavenly assembly?
If you're talking about him in Job, the context shows why he was there. It's a story about Job. Satan was allowed access to Job, in order to show job's faithfulness.

Not that Satan was allowed access to Job, its that a fallen and cursed angel seems to be just waltzing in to God's assembly with God's Sons.
Not sure what your point is here. Whether one believes that sons of God refers to fallen angels, or not, the text still says that Satan was before God.
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Re: Were the Nephilim and the Sumerian mythical kings somehow related?

#398

Post by RickD » Thu Aug 24, 2017 12:12 pm

Stu wrote:
PaulSacramento wrote:
RickD wrote:
PaulSacramento wrote:Does anyone care to address why the leader of the fallen angels, one banned from the Garden of Eden and cursed, would be allowed to be among the Sons of God in YHWH's heavenly assembly?
If you're talking about him in Job, the context shows why he was there. It's a story about Job. Satan was allowed access to Job, in order to show job's faithfulness.

Not that Satan was allowed access to Job, its that a fallen and cursed angel seems to be just waltzing in to God's assembly with God's Sons.
Yeah I also found that a bit odd.
Stu,

I find something odd that maybe you can help me understand. How can a YEC believe in the angel/human hybrid Nephilim theory, and stay consistent to one of the crucial arguments of YEC?

Let me explain. Many yecs including yourself, have said over and over, that evolution cannot be possible, because God created kinds. And each kind can only reproduce with its own kind. This is a crucial point that one must believe, if one is a YEC. Yet, when it comes to angels mating with humans, the entire "kind" argument gets tossed aside.

How do you account for that?
1 Corinthians 1:9
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Re: Were the Nephilim and the Sumerian mythical kings somehow related?

#399

Post by PaulSacramento » Thu Aug 24, 2017 12:18 pm

RickD wrote:
PaulSacramento wrote:
RickD wrote:
PaulSacramento wrote:Does anyone care to address why the leader of the fallen angels, one banned from the Garden of Eden and cursed, would be allowed to be among the Sons of God in YHWH's heavenly assembly?
If you're talking about him in Job, the context shows why he was there. It's a story about Job. Satan was allowed access to Job, in order to show job's faithfulness.

Not that Satan was allowed access to Job, its that a fallen and cursed angel seems to be just waltzing in to God's assembly with God's Sons.
Not sure what your point is here. Whether one believes that sons of God refers to fallen angels, or not, the text still says that Satan was before God.
My query is a logical one Rick.
How does a being that was cast out and cursed seem to have open access not only to heaven but to approach God along with His Sons?

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Re: Were the Nephilim and the Sumerian mythical kings somehow related?

#400

Post by PaulSacramento » Thu Aug 24, 2017 12:23 pm

John 8:
You Are of Your Father the Devil
39 They answered him, “Abraham is our father.” Jesus said to them, “If you were Abraham's children, you would be doing the works Abraham did, 40 but now you seek to kill me, a man who has told you the truth that I heard from God. This is not what Abraham did. 41 You are doing the works your father did.” They said to him, “We were not born of sexual immorality. We have one Father—even God.” 42 Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love me, for I came from God and I am here. I came not of my own accord, but he sent me. 43 Why do you not understand what I say? It is because you cannot bear to hear my word. 44 You are of your father the devil, and your will is to do your father's desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks out of his own character, for he is a liar and the father of lies. 45 But because I tell the truth, you do not believe me. 46 Which one of you convicts me of sin? If I tell the truth, why do you not believe me? 47 Whoever is of God hears the words of God. The reason why you do not hear them is that you are not of God.”
Are we to read this and think that Jesus meant that they are BEGOTTEN of The Devil? actual children "born of" The Devil or is Jesus using hyperbole?
Is Jesus stating that his accusers are actual OF The Devil or that they belong to The Devil because they reject Him?

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Re: Were the Nephilim and the Sumerian mythical kings somehow related?

#401

Post by PaulSacramento » Thu Aug 24, 2017 12:25 pm

DBowling wrote:
B. W. wrote:+
Conclusion:

So, what is being presented here is evidence that the Sethite and Human Leader doctrines concerning the son’s of God mentions in Gen 6:1-12, came not as inspired from the bible but rather from an well-known ancient apocryphal Jewish source which is today known as the Books of Adam and Eve, or The Cave Treasures.

Books mind you used by Jewish Mystic Kabbalist with scriptural errors too numerous to list here.

If the book of Enoch, Josephus, Philo, Book of Jasher, Jude and Peters Letters as well as the fragments found in the Dead Sea Scrolls cannot be used either, then, the same rule must apply to Augustine’s work and the Books of Adam and Eve from which the doctrines of the Sethite and human leader point of view originates from...

Now we are back to square one.
Which means that if we want to understand what Scripture means when it uses the phrase "sons of God" in Genesis 6, then it makes sense to make like the Bereans and focus on how Scripture uses the phrase "sons of God" instead of relying on any extrascriptural traditions which lead to a definition that is inconsistent with what Jesus says in John 8.
So one can be a Son of God" up until the point that they rebel against God.
So Satan was a Son of God until he rebelled, according to your view, and at that moment, the moment he was cast out, he lost his status as a "son of God".

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Re: Were the Nephilim and the Sumerian mythical kings somehow related?

#402

Post by RickD » Thu Aug 24, 2017 12:28 pm

PaulSacramento wrote:
RickD wrote:
PaulSacramento wrote:
RickD wrote:
PaulSacramento wrote:Does anyone care to address why the leader of the fallen angels, one banned from the Garden of Eden and cursed, would be allowed to be among the Sons of God in YHWH's heavenly assembly?
If you're talking about him in Job, the context shows why he was there. It's a story about Job. Satan was allowed access to Job, in order to show job's faithfulness.

Not that Satan was allowed access to Job, its that a fallen and cursed angel seems to be just waltzing in to God's assembly with God's Sons.
Not sure what your point is here. Whether one believes that sons of God refers to fallen angels, or not, the text still says that Satan was before God.
My query is a logical one Rick.
How does a being that was cast out and cursed seem to have open access not only to heaven but to approach God along with His Sons?
Where does the Bible say that Satan has open access to heaven?
1 Corinthians 1:9
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Re: Were the Nephilim and the Sumerian mythical kings somehow related?

#403

Post by DBowling » Thu Aug 24, 2017 12:39 pm

PaulSacramento wrote:
So one can be a Son of God" up until the point that they rebel against God.
So Satan was a Son of God until he rebelled, according to your view, and at that moment, the moment he was cast out, he lost his status as a "son of God".
If one is an angel... then yes, that accurately represents my position.

This discussion reminds me of a prayer I used to pray every night as a young child.
I was convinced that if only Satan would get saved, then all the bad things in the world would go away.
So I prayed for Satan to get saved every night.

PaulSacramento
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Re: Were the Nephilim and the Sumerian mythical kings somehow related?

#404

Post by PaulSacramento » Thu Aug 24, 2017 12:41 pm

RickD wrote:
PaulSacramento wrote:
RickD wrote:
PaulSacramento wrote:
RickD wrote: If you're talking about him in Job, the context shows why he was there. It's a story about Job. Satan was allowed access to Job, in order to show job's faithfulness.

Not that Satan was allowed access to Job, its that a fallen and cursed angel seems to be just waltzing in to God's assembly with God's Sons.
Not sure what your point is here. Whether one believes that sons of God refers to fallen angels, or not, the text still says that Satan was before God.
My query is a logical one Rick.
How does a being that was cast out and cursed seem to have open access not only to heaven but to approach God along with His Sons?
Where does the Bible say that Satan has open access to heaven?

He came along with the Sons of God in Job 1 and 2

6 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan also came among them. 7 The Lord said to Satan, “From where have you come?” Satan answered the Lord and said, “From going to and fro on the earth, and from walking up and down on it.”


Does that strike as someone that doesn't come and go as he pleases ??
Satan openly states that he has come from going "to and fro on the Earth" and "walking around on it".

The text doesn't seem to imply that he is NOT allowed to be there or that he "snuck in".

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Re: Were the Nephilim and the Sumerian mythical kings somehow related?

#405

Post by PaulSacramento » Thu Aug 24, 2017 12:42 pm

DBowling wrote:
PaulSacramento wrote:
So one can be a Son of God" up until the point that they rebel against God.
So Satan was a Son of God until he rebelled, according to your view, and at that moment, the moment he was cast out, he lost his status as a "son of God".
If one is an angel... then yes, that accurately represents my position.

This discussion reminds me of a prayer I used to pray every night as a young child.
I was convinced that if only Satan would get saved, then all the bad things in the world would go away.
So I prayed for Satan to get saved every night.

I am ok with that view BUT I have to ask:
Where in the bible does it state that?
Where does the bible say that a Son of God, an angelic being, is no longer a son of God if they rebel ?

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