"The heavens declare the glory of God; the skies proclaim the work of his hands." (Psalm 19:1)
https://discussions.godandscience.org/
I don't want to participate in this discussion because I think you are doing an excellent job. As far as the answer to your question above, the boiling point of water is absolute: water boils when it reaches its vapor pressure. As morals are absolute, so are the constants of physics.Echoside wrote:What is the boiling point of water?
Furstentum Liechtenstein wrote:I don't want to participate in this discussion because I think you are doing an excellent job. As far as the answer to your question above, the boiling point of water is absolute: water boils when it reaches its vapor pressure. As morals are absolute, so are the constants of physics.Echoside wrote:What is the boiling point of water?
Carry on.
FL
Okay. So in answer to my original question--are the teachings of the bible morally perfect and infallible--would you answer yes to that question?Echoside wrote:Let's look at a different question, that's more applicable to my thoughts on -most- questions of morality.MAGSolo wrote: I define absolute as complete or unchanging, perfect in definition. What it is today is what it was 1000 years in the past and what it will be 1000 years in the future. For example the constituents of water are absolute. Water was made of H20 a billion years ago and it will be made of h20 a billion years from now.
What is the boiling point of water?
Without bringing in any assumptions about the question, it's unanswerable. We do not know, for example, the atmospheric pressure at the water's location. If I modified my question to : What is the boiling point of water at standard atmospheric pressure? There is now an "objective" answer of 100 degrees Celsius. The boiling point of water might change if I increased my elevation 2 miles, but the answer to the question is absolute. Water will not suddenly start to boil at 0 degrees Celsius given the same conditions.
Now let's look at the question, Is it wrong to kill? Same as above, the question is unanswerable. It doesn't even make sense, the act of killing is not inherently wrong, it is the conditions around it that make it correct or incorrect. Now if I ask "under the conditions of the early Hebrews in the OT was the killing commanded by God wrong" we have something to go on. Most Christians would say no. And that is an objective answer to a specific question. It is not possible that those same circumstances are reproduced and the act is NOT justified.
If the exact conditions of biblical times one billion years in the future were reproduced, they would still be justified. There will only ever be ONE objective answer to all questions of morality. Most of them just don't make any sense to answer, given statements like "is stealing wrong?". All cases of stealing that are the same have an absolute answer. And if they are not the same then to criticize them for not being uniform is senseless.MAGSolo wrote: Likewise absolute morality would men that what is right or wrong a billion years ago would still be right and wrong a billion years in the future.
that's correctMAGSolo wrote: Okay. So in answer to my original question--are the teachings of the bible morally perfect and infallible--would you answer yes to that question?
Seriously, how many times do we need to go down this road?MAGSolo wrote:So anything that is taught in the bible would be an acceptable way to live ones life or for a group of people (like a country maybe) to live their lives?
Okay, Mag, then you tell me, what would it take to answer your questions (whatever they may be) to your satisfaction? Please draw me a line in the sand so I know when I've crossed it I can say for certain that your questions have been answered.MAGSolo wrote:I would think as many times as it takes to get the question answered in a satisfactory manner.
MAGSolo, what specifically do you have in mind here? Are you asking, for example, are the specific laws given to Old Testament Israel, laws that a modern country should live by?MAGSolo wrote:So anything that is taught in the bible would be an acceptable way to live ones life or for a group of people (like a country maybe) to live their lives?
Not necessarily. What conditions are you thinking of? For example, NT teachings are never presented as something to be enforced as a law of the land. They are given as instructions for people who believe in Christ. In fact, we are told not to try to judge or govern those outside the faith. However, there are some things in the scripture, that if practiced, even non-beleivers would benefit from. Other things would be a total disaster.So anything that is taught in the bible would be an acceptable way to live ones life or for a group of people (like a country maybe) to live their lives?
Your question is loaded. If you really think that we can't see a question loaded with presuppositions, bias, and a disdain for the Bible, then you are foolin yourself.MAGSolo wrote:I would think as many times as it takes to get the question answered in a satisfactory manner.
They are questions asked from a skeptical viewpoint yes. I dont see why that should matter thoughjlay wrote:Not necessarily. What conditions are you thinking of? For example, NT teachings are never presented as something to be enforced as a law of the land. They are given as instructions for people who believe in Christ. In fact, we are told not to try to judge or govern those outside the faith. However, there are some things in the scripture, that if practiced, even non-beleivers would benefit from. Other things would be a total disaster.So anything that is taught in the bible would be an acceptable way to live ones life or for a group of people (like a country maybe) to live their lives?
Your question is loaded. If you really think that we can't see a question loaded with presuppositions, bias, and a disdain for the Bible, then you are foolin yourself.MAGSolo wrote:I would think as many times as it takes to get the question answered in a satisfactory manner.
MAGSolo wrote:They are questions asked from a skeptical viewpoint yes. I dont see why that should matter thoughjlay wrote:Not necessarily. What conditions are you thinking of? For example, NT teachings are never presented as something to be enforced as a law of the land. They are given as instructions for people who believe in Christ. In fact, we are told not to try to judge or govern those outside the faith. However, there are some things in the scripture, that if practiced, even non-beleivers would benefit from. Other things would be a total disaster.So anything that is taught in the bible would be an acceptable way to live ones life or for a group of people (like a country maybe) to live their lives?
Your question is loaded. If you really think that we can't see a question loaded with presuppositions, bias, and a disdain for the Bible, then you are foolin yourself.MAGSolo wrote:I would think as many times as it takes to get the question answered in a satisfactory manner.
Did you not read anything I said?MAGSolo wrote:So anything that is taught in the bible would be an acceptable way to live ones life or for a group of people (like a country maybe) to live their lives?