born out of wedlock, the bible says I can't go to heaven

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educationreigns
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born out of wedlock, the bible says I can't go to heaven

#1

Post by educationreigns » Sat Mar 03, 2012 4:50 am

born out of wedlock, the bible says I cant go to heaven
Deuteronomy 23-2 "A bastard shall not enter into the congregation of the LORD; even to his tenth generation shall he not enter into the congregation of the LORD”

I just can't believe in something that says this, I don't think I deserve to be punished. And if other verses contradict this one, than can't we just agree that the bible has some good stuff and bad stuff that we should not live by? It depends on what church you go to as to what verses you have to follow to be a true christian, and which you don't. So can't god come from within, instead of a book that has clearly racist, sexist, and hateful passages? What if you were born on an Island and did not know about Christianity? I like the idea of being kind and understanding and to not hurt people, but the bible talks about killing all the time (unless it's a virgin woman, you don't kill her) I don't think I want a religion I just want a compassionate way of life.

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Re: born out of wedlock, the bible says I can't go to heaven

#2

Post by Kurieuo » Sat Mar 03, 2012 6:16 am

Sounds like you have your beliefs down pat, and your judgements and questions are more rhetorical. May I ask why you are here?

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Re: born out of wedlock, the bible says I can't go to heaven

#3

Post by Kurieuo » Sat Mar 03, 2012 6:49 am

educationreigns wrote:born out of wedlock, the bible says I cant go to heaven
Deuteronomy 23-2 "A bastard shall not enter into the congregation of the LORD; even to his tenth generation shall he not enter into the congregation of the LORD”

I just can't believe in something that says this, I don't think I deserve to be punished. And if other verses contradict this one, than can't we just agree that the bible has some good stuff and bad stuff that we should not live by? It depends on what church you go to as to what verses you have to follow to be a true christian, and which you don't. So can't god come from within, instead of a book that has clearly racist, sexist, and hateful passages? What if you were born on an Island and did not know about Christianity? I like the idea of being kind and understanding and to not hurt people, but the bible talks about killing all the time (unless it's a virgin woman, you don't kill her) I don't think I want a religion I just want a compassionate way of life.
Deut 1:1-4 --
  • 1 These are the words Moses spoke to all Israel in the wilderness east of the Jordan—that is, in the Arabah—opposite Suph, between Paran and Tophel, Laban, Hazeroth and Dizahab. 2 (It takes eleven days to go from Horeb to Kadesh Barnea by the Mount Seir road.)

    3 In the fortieth year, on the first day of the eleventh month, Moses proclaimed to the Israelites all that the LORD had commanded him concerning them. 4 This was after he had defeated Sihon king of the Amorites, who reigned in Heshbon, and at Edrei had defeated Og king of Bashan, who reigned in Ashtaroth.
Deut 4:1-8 --
  • 1 Now, Israel, hear the decrees and laws I am about to teach you. Follow them so that you may live and may go in and take possession of the land the LORD, the God of your ancestors, is giving you. 2 Do not add to what I command you and do not subtract from it, but keep the commands of the LORD your God that I give you.

    3 You saw with your own eyes what the LORD did at Baal Peor. The LORD your God destroyed from among you everyone who followed the Baal of Peor, 4 but all of you who held fast to the LORD your God are still alive today.

    5 See, I have taught you decrees and laws as the LORD my God commanded me, so that you may follow them in the land you are entering to take possession of it. 6 Observe them carefully, for this will show your wisdom and understanding to the nations, who will hear about all these decrees and say, “Surely this great nation is a wise and understanding people.” 7 What other nation is so great as to have their gods near them the way the LORD our God is near us whenever we pray to him? 8 And what other nation is so great as to have such righteous decrees and laws as this body of laws I am setting before you today?
Thankfully, you're not living back in the time of Moses huh? Otherwise you would be forbidden from becoming Jewish.

Also, to the 10th generation, the actual intention is that their descendants would be cut off forever (cf. Deut 23:3). Now, while I'm not a bastard child, in all probability somewhere throughout my family lineage, one of my forefathers were born out of wedlock too. And I dare say many other Christians here if not all. So by your own interpretation that this passage is universal in scope and application, talking about everyone at every time, and "heaven" is real meaning of "congregation of the Lord"... then we're all doomed as well. In which case I should just say to you, join the club.

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Re: born out of wedlock, the bible says I can't go to heaven

#4

Post by jlay » Sat Mar 03, 2012 9:20 am

Perhaps before you bring up such objections, you should study hermanuetics. This way you would understand that your 'genuine' concern was,.... well, :pound: ....bunk.
-“The Bible treated allegorically becomes putty in the hands of the exegete.” John Walvoord

"I'm not saying scientists don't overstate their results. They do. And it's understandable, too...If you spend years working toward a certain goal and make no progress, of course you are going to spin your results in a positive light." Ivellious

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Re: born out of wedlock, the bible says I can't go to heaven

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Post by educationreigns » Sat Mar 03, 2012 3:18 pm

So you are saying the bible is "bunk"...

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Re: born out of wedlock, the bible says I can't go to heaven

#6

Post by educationreigns » Sat Mar 03, 2012 3:29 pm

You all are very defensive and are showing no compassion for my question... do you believe all the verses of the bible or not? some you can believe to be true but other passages are just culture?? I believe in god any I don't need a book that is out dated, as everyone is pointing out. So why are you so faithful about the bible? It was written thousands of years ago for a different time and culture.

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Re: born out of wedlock, the bible says I can't go to heaven

#7

Post by educationreigns » Sat Mar 03, 2012 3:50 pm

I am angered by these replies. You are trying to make me feel bad just because my name is education reigns( can Christians make fun of people like you are doing to me?) but all I am doing is reading the bible and confronting verses that are not suitable for our common era. All I'm trying to ask is do Christians believe everything the bible says, or not? You are not someone I would take advise from because you called my question "bunk"> That is the #1 no-no for teachers to say. Are you a teacher of the word? All I want people to tell me is that I'm not going to burn in hell just because I don't believe everything the bible says.

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Re: born out of wedlock, the bible says I can't go to heaven

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Post by Kurieuo » Sat Mar 03, 2012 4:01 pm

I thought my response was quite considerate considering your first posts here were both very much on the attack (I respectfully bring your attention to our board purpose).

I believe what the Bible says, but I do not expect non-Christians to. And it is clear who Deuteronomy is written to in the passages I quoted earlier. If you are being offended by having your mud slung at us so easily wash away, then I make no apology since you were first going on the offense.

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Re: born out of wedlock, the bible says I can't go to heaven

#9

Post by educationreigns » Sat Mar 03, 2012 4:08 pm

That was the nicest reply but I read it, and I still don't see how those verses counter act the very clear verse. I did not know how to contact you directly, my post just went up to everyone. I sound upset in my posts because I don't believe I'm going to hell because I don't believe EVERYTHING the bible says, like you all believe. If you believe in the bible you would not let women teach and so on... do you believe every verse?

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Re: born out of wedlock, the bible says I can't go to heaven

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Post by dayage » Sat Mar 03, 2012 4:25 pm

educationreigns,
born out of wedlock, the bible says I cant go to heaven
Deuteronomy 23-2 "A bastard shall not enter into the congregation of the LORD; even to his tenth generation shall he not enter into the congregation of the LORD”
This is saying that those individuals are not allowed to be part of the Jewish nation. So, who are they?
Deut. 23:2 2 No one born of a forbidden marriage (mamzer) nor any of his descendants may enter the assembly of the LORD, even down to the tenth generation.
3 No Ammonite or Moabite or any of his descendants may enter the assembly of the LORD, even down to the tenth generation.
The term mamzer seems to refer to those born to a Jewish father and a non-jewish mother. I belive that these two verses go together and that verse two is forbidding the intermairrage of Jews with the people of the land of Cannan. This can be seen in other passages (Ex. 34:11-16; Deut. 7:1-6; Joshua 23:12-13; I Kings 11; Ezra 9:1-4; Neh. 13:1-3, 23-30). The reason was that the foreigners would lead them away from God.

This did not apply to the Egyptians (Deut. 23:7-8; Ex. 12:37-38).

One exception found in the Bible is Ruth. She was a Moabite woman, but she turned from the gods of her people to follow the One true God (Ruth 1:1-16).

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Re: born out of wedlock, the bible says I can't go to heaven

#11

Post by educationreigns » Sat Mar 03, 2012 4:33 pm

I still don't have an answer, do you believe in EVERY bible verse or NOT? I read your reply thoughtfully and hope you don't think I dislike you. I believe in loving my fellow man I'm just upset.

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Re: born out of wedlock, the bible says I can't go to heaven

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Post by Kurieuo » Sat Mar 03, 2012 4:41 pm

Sounds like you came here very emotionally charged with verses you seem to only want to see in a very one dimensional and personal context.

Firstly, as stated in your other thread, being Christian is not based on what one thinks of Scripture, but rather one's response to Christ. So I point you to examine His claims.

To respond to your question, I take Scripture to be truth, but strongly believe one should never read a bible verse. Reading verses on their own results in their being taken out of context and as such wrongly read and misapplied.

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Re: born out of wedlock, the bible says I can't go to heaven

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Post by B. W. » Sat Mar 03, 2012 4:54 pm

educationreigns wrote:I still don't have an answer, do you believe in EVERY bible verse or NOT? I read your reply thoughtfully and hope you don't think I dislike you. I believe in loving my fellow man I'm just upset.
You received very adequate answers regarding you statement. Suggest you look on the main web page of this site and review many of the articles.

You observe passages here referring to Old Testament (OT) Law. OT law purpose was to expose sin, define it, and point to the need for Jesus Christ to deal with it. As it is written…

Gal 3:24, "Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith." NKJV

This verse says backs up what I just stated…

Romans 3:20, "Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin." NKJV

Again…

Romans 8:3, 4, 5, "For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh, 4 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit." NKJV

Romans 3:28, "Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith apart from the deeds of the law."

So, if your desire is to place your trust in the OT Law – then live by it and you’ll discover that sin revives and you, yourself, will be cut off from the congregation of the Lord.

Have you come to Christ, yet?

If so, you share what Jesus Christ did?

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Re: born out of wedlock, the bible says I can't go to heaven

#14

Post by Tina » Sat Mar 03, 2012 5:09 pm

Kurieuo wrote:Sounds like you came here very emotionally charged with verses you seem to only want to see in a very one dimensional and personal context.

Firstly, as stated in your other thread, being Christian is not based on what one thinks of Scripture, but rather one's response to Christ. So I point you to examine His claims.

To respond to your question, I take Scripture to be truth, but strongly believe one should never read a bible verse. Reading verses on their own results in their being taken out of context and as such wrongly read and misapplied.

I totally agree with you
"Love others as I have loved you." -Jesus Christ

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Re: born out of wedlock, the bible says I can't go to heaven

#15

Post by dayage » Sat Mar 03, 2012 5:11 pm

educationreigns,
I still don't have an answer, do you believe in EVERY bible verse or NOT?
Of course I do, but quoting a text without the context is just a pretext.


B.W.
Good word.

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