Fall of man

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Jay_7
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Fall of man

#1

Post by Jay_7 » Fri Jan 27, 2006 6:45 pm

When the fasll of man occured, there must of already been pain and death before it because when you hit a metal object it hurts, or anything else, and is God saying before the fall of man it was impossible to drown or die?

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Jac3510
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#2

Post by Jac3510 » Sat Jan 28, 2006 7:21 am

There are a lot of people, especially in the YEC camp, that hold to the idea that death was impossible prior to the fall. They base this on the nature of the fall (esp Gen. 2:17; 3:19) and Paul's statement that death came into the world through Adam in Rom. 5:12. Those in the OEC camp don't have to believe this at all, because for many of them, the death that resulted from the Fall is spiritual death, that is, separation from God. Physical death existed prefall, especially in the animal kingdom.

I can't say for 100% sure which is right, but I think Vos makes a great point on it:
Geerhadus Vos wrote:. . . 'immortality' is used in the theological terminology for that state of man in which he has nothing in him which would cause death. It is quite possible that at the same time an abstract contingency of death may overhang man, i.e., the bare possibility may exist of death in some way, for some cause, invading him, but he has nothing of it within him. (Biblical Theology, 1975, p. 38)
As for me, I have not come to a firm conclusion, but it seems to me that either:

a) Man was created 'immortal' in the above sense, that is, death from an external cause was possible, but man did not have death "within himself"," or
b) Man was created completely mortal, in the sense that he would have died eventually even without sin, and the death that entered into the world was only spiritual in nature.

In either case, I think I would reject the impossibility of death, but then again . . . we could always be wrong ;)

God bless
Proinsias wrote:I don't think you are hearing me. Preference for ice cream is a moral issue
And that, brothers and sisters, is the kind of foolishness you get people who insist on denying biblical theism. A good illustration of any as the length people will go to avoid acknowledging basic truths.

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#3

Post by LadyHel » Tue Feb 07, 2006 1:58 pm

surely death being impossible would be a bad thing as it would means nobody could have children, due to the whole overpopulation (not that we haven't managed that anyway.)
And a world without pain wouldn't be great either- pain is based on nerve reaction (If anyone disagrees, please say) and is just an extreme of the sense of touch. Would that mean you wouldn't be able to feel anything at all?

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