Opening of heart

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Vash
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Opening of heart

#1

Post by Vash » Fri Jun 16, 2006 5:06 am

Hello everyone.

I've been struggling with whether or not I believe God exist. In my mind I can see how the Bible applies to reality, but my heart is still stuck on naturalistic evolution, and all that. It's a very closed-hearted situation.

So, my request is that you pray for God to open my heart to the evidence of His existence. Thank you.

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Canuckster1127
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Re: Opening of heart

#2

Post by Canuckster1127 » Fri Jun 16, 2006 6:26 am

Vash wrote:Hello everyone.

I've been struggling with whether or not I believe God exist. In my mind I can see how the Bible applies to reality, but my heart is still stuck on naturalistic evolution, and all that. It's a very closed-hearted situation.

So, my request is that you pray for God to open my heart to the evidence of His existence. Thank you.
Vash,

You have my prayers.

I'd encourage you to look on the main board and look through some of the threads here.

Officially the board does not support the idea of evolution on the large scale espoused by methodological naturalists. I don't either. But, as an Old Earth Creationist, I believe the earth is very old, that evolution certainly has been proven scientifically at some levels and is good science and that science and the use of the mind has very beneficial results and all truth, regardless of its source in the study of God's creation, or through God's revelation in the Bible is to be embraced.

We don't understand it all. We all have a lot to learn.

Belief in the existence of God is a bedrock important issue obviously. Christianity is first and foremost a relationship and for a relationship to exist, God must exist and we must believe He is there, loves us and wants us in right relationship with him.

I'd encourage you to go this page on the main site and spend some time looking through the common reasons for doubt of the existence of God and see if maybe some of those issues are what you are wrestling with and view some of the answers there.

http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/answers.html

If you have further questions and want to talk about them, post them here and we'll talk them through.

Blessings,

Bart
Dogmatism is the comfortable intellectual framework of self-righteousness. Self-righteousness is more decadent than the worst sexual sin. ~ Dan Allender

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#3

Post by FFC » Fri Jun 16, 2006 9:35 am

You are in my prayers, Vash. If you sincerely want to enter into a saving relationship with God then He is nearer than you think. At some point you are going to have to take the leap of faith because there are many many more questions and concerns that you will stumble upon even after you get saved.


As you read through these threads you see many different takes on what we believe, and you'll even see some heated debates, but the one thing we all have in common is that we know that salvation is given to us by God, in His Grace, when we put our faith in Him and believe that He sent His only begotten son to die on the cross to forgive us, cleanse us and take away all our sins.

It's not about what you don't believe. It's about what you do.

Just remember what the father of the son who was possesed by the demon said to Jesus when He asked the father if he belived that he could heal his son. The father said "I believe, but help me with my unbelief". Jesus immediately healed the boy.

Vash, read John chapter 3. Nicodemus had doubts about what Jesus meant when He said "you must be born again" and He patiently explained it to him. The botton line is that the hows and whys and everything else that trip us up are meaningless when it comes to salvation. All that is required is to come to Jesus in faith and believe that He is the only way to eternal life...just like He said.

I'm praying for you, Vash!

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#4

Post by Vash » Sun Jun 18, 2006 12:46 pm

Thanks for all the prayers and support guys.

However I do have a concern. Does God ever create someone just to send them to Hell? I mean, intentionally make their path in life a Godless one?

I don't know. That question seems to be nagging at my heart right now and I was wondering if that is a possibility, if that is what God made my life out to be? I mean, I was a theist for all 17 years of my life, but then when I was introduced to genuine Christianity, I started having doubts and then I went into debates with people and became agnostic.

In my heart I just find it odd that God would allow a theist to turn agnostic as a result of Christianity being introduced into their life(if that makes sense). It seems almost instinctive that that's what God's doing to me and it makes me nervous.

If that doesn't make sense to anyone, let me know and I'll re-word it. :oops:

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Canuckster1127
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#5

Post by Canuckster1127 » Sun Jun 18, 2006 3:19 pm

Vash wrote:Thanks for all the prayers and support guys.

However I do have a concern. Does God ever create someone just to send them to Hell? I mean, intentionally make their path in life a Godless one?

I don't know. That question seems to be nagging at my heart right now and I was wondering if that is a possibility, if that is what God made my life out to be? I mean, I was a theist for all 17 years of my life, but then when I was introduced to genuine Christianity, I started having doubts and then I went into debates with people and became agnostic.

In my heart I just find it odd that God would allow a theist to turn agnostic as a result of Christianity being introduced into their life(if that makes sense). It seems almost instinctive that that's what God's doing to me and it makes me nervous.

If that doesn't make sense to anyone, let me know and I'll re-word it. :oops:
There are different opinions regarding this.

I personally do not believe that God creates anyone for the purpose of predestining them to hell without hope.

I believe God, because he is God, knows the choices we make and will make. Further I believe God has a plan which he will accomplish and which is not subject or hostage to anything we may or may not do.

How those two facts reconcile, I can't explain to my own satifaction and so I choose to embrace by faith that there are things that I cannot understand in full and that these are due to the fact that God is infinite and I cannot grasp everything.

I do know this however.

I have accepted Christ as my savior. God has indwelled me with His Holy Spirit. I have had seasons of doubt throughout my Christian life (31 years now.) I always return the basics when I find myself in that position.

More than anything what Christianity is, is a relationship not simply a religious system of thinking or behavior. In order for that relationship to remain strong it requires investment on my part on a regular basis. I find the same thing to be true in my marriage (22 years in August.)

More can be said and will be if you desire. I appreciate the honesty of your questions.
Dogmatism is the comfortable intellectual framework of self-righteousness. Self-righteousness is more decadent than the worst sexual sin. ~ Dan Allender

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#6

Post by Kurieuo » Sun Jun 18, 2006 7:17 pm

Vash wrote:Thanks for all the prayers and support guys.

However I do have a concern. Does God ever create someone just to send them to Hell? I mean, intentionally make their path in life a Godless one?
First, remove God from the question to come to terms with your thoughts regarding free will vs determinism. That is, are we free to make decisions or are all our actions determined by our physical makeup and physics simply going through their natural course of events?

If the latter, then presumably God could make us do things via fine-tuning physical laws. Yet then, who are "we"? Who are "you"? If everything is determined by laws, then there appears to be no room for "we", "you" or "I" in our physical bodies which simply follow the laws of the universe like an apple falling from a tree. Thus, under determinism God does not send us to hell, for there is essentially no "us" to send to hell.

Now if we have free will, which I believe to be the more obvious and intuitive position, then it is impossible for God to make us to do anything. For if God allows us freedom with our decisions, God hands control over to us in a way which we are able to express ourselves. Some theologians including myself believe this is one area where we are made in God's image--possessing a creative and free ability similar to God. We are little "gods" with power to shape our lives, impact upon others, and do as we please, only being limited by physical restraints (thankfully!). Thus, we make our own paths in life and are ultimately responsible for the decisions we make despite influences external to ourselves.
Vash wrote:In my heart I just find it odd that God would allow a theist to turn agnostic as a result of Christianity being introduced into their life(if that makes sense). It seems almost instinctive that that's what God's doing to me and it makes me nervous.
Yes, this is a catch-22. Many people spend so much time desiring freedom, to then shrink back once they have it due a fear of making wrong decisions. It seems the heart of your thoughts would first lie with deciding whether you believe in determinism or some form of free will. I've attempted to address your question either way above.

I will say that love is only possible if we have a capacity to make free decisions. A rock cannot love its Maker. Animals can in some limited capacity, although I think it is a given they don't have complete understanding. The Christian response is God desired persons fully aware, not only who he could love, but who could respond entirely back to him. If love is an ultimate good, then freedom was required (despite all the bad which comes with it) for God to bring about such an ultimate good.

Kurieuo
"Whoever will call on the name of the Lord will be saved." (Romans 10:13)

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#7

Post by Vash » Sun Jun 18, 2006 10:24 pm

Canuckster wrote:More can be said and will be if you desire. I appreciate the honesty of your questions.
If it's not much to ask, I would be interested in what else you have to say.

Also, I don't want all of you to think your prayers haven't helped, because now that I think of it, I did recently find out that God will renew people's faith if they are fully willing and desirable of it. So now I think God might (assumming He truly doesn't predestine people to Hell) be trying to change my heart and make me fully willing (the more I thought of it, I do want a relationship with God and I've told Him that - as if He needed me to - but there are a few bad habits of mine that would be very hard for me to give up). I did feel my first sense of pridelessness (... if that's a word... :? ) since I was a child, today. So, yeah, I suppose the HS might be working in me, but this question is driving my heart crazy and I'm worried that it's a sign or something.

Then again, since Satan can be decieving, can he even toy with our hearts and make us feel like something worry-worthy is the truth (hope that makes sense)? Because that might be what's happening to me.

Also, if it's not too much to ask, can someone refer me to the verses that touch up on the "Free Will or Predestine" topic just so I can see it for myself? Thanks.

And thanks again to everyone for all your help.

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