controversial scriptures

[jenna]

Another controversy. What is the reward of the saved? Do the saved go to heaven? If so, then when?

[JCSx2]

Another controversy. What is the reward of the saved? Do the saved go to heaven? If so, then when?

Where is this? I would like to see it in context.

[jenna]

I have found a few scriptures that seem to imply that we don't go to heaven immediately when we die. The verse are Acts 2:29, and 34. I guess the question here is since David was a man after God's own heart, would he not be in heaven now? Or am I reading these verses wrong? Another verse would be John 3:13.

[frankbaginski]

There are many harvest of souls in the Bible. They are clearly laid out. I placed a post in Bible and Scripture - The Time of the Gentiles which details some of the common understanding of these events. I included some background prophetic language to help with the scriptures. If after that you still have questions I may be able to point in the right direction.

[jenna]

There are many harvest of souls in the Bible. They are clearly laid out. I placed a post in Bible and Scripture - The Time of the Gentiles which details some of the common understanding of these events. I included some background prophetic language to help with the scriptures. If after that you still have questions I may be able to point in the right direction.

I have read this post now Frank, and I don't really see anything that helps me out as far as what is the reward of the saved. All I have seen are your descriptions of God's Holy Days. (Which, by the way, I don't agree with either, but that can be a later post).

[frankbaginski]

Jen,

The big reward of the saved is of course is to spend eternity with God. Beyond this all else is nothing. There are a few scriptures that indicate that some works can place you at different levels of reward.

Mat 5:12 Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you.

Joh 14:2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.

Rev 4:4 And round about the throne were four and twenty seats: and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of gold.

Mat 18:4 Whosoever therefore shall humble himself as this little child, the same is greatest in the kingdom of heaven.

Mat 6:20 But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:

Mat 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

If there is a least and a great in heaven then there is some kind of reward.

[jenna]

I agree with this. My point is WHEN? The bible clearly says no one has seen heaven. So if that is the reward, when do we go to heaven?

[FFC]

I agree with this. My point is WHEN? The bible clearly says no one has seen heaven. So if that is the reward, when do we go to heaven?

To be absent from the body is to ne present with the Lord.

[jenna]

This doesn't help. WHEN is the question here.

[FFC]

This doesn't help. WHEN is the question here.

Careful, you might knock some sense into yourself. We are absent from the body at the exact time of our physical death.

[jenna]

Yeah maybe I might get some sense somewhere. I'm not really getting much sense from this. The David question came out of Acts, which was after Jesus died. So if David wasn't in heaven in Acts, then where was he?

[Cross.eyed]

I have found a few scriptures that seem to imply that we don't go to heaven immediately when we die. The verse are Acts 2:29, and 34. I guess the question here is since David was a man after God's own heart, would he not be in heaven now? Or am I reading these verses wrong? Another verse would be John 3:13.

The greek word for sepulchre is mnaymion meaning grave (vs.29) Verse 34 refers to Davids body in resurrection, not his soul which is in heaven. Jn. 3:13 is of the same terms i.e. Christ being first fruits is the only bodily resurrection.

Best I can tell the Bible doesn't teach soul "sleep".

[FFC]

Yeah maybe I might get some sense somewhere. I'm not really getting much sense from this. The David question came out of Acts, which was after Jesus died. So if David wasn't in heaven in Acts, then where was he?

I think it is talking more about David not being risen from the dead and physically ascending to heaven like Jesus did. Before Jesus came all saints prior to that were in a compartment hades called paradise. This is how I understand it right now...but I could be wrong.

[jenna]

I have found a few scriptures that seem to imply that we don't go to heaven immediately when we die. The verse are Acts 2:29, and 34. I guess the question here is since David was a man after God's own heart, would he not be in heaven now? Or am I reading these verses wrong? Another verse would be John 3:13.

The greek word for sepulchre is mnaymion meaning grave (vs.29) Verse 34 refers to Davids body in resurrection, not his soul which is in heaven. Jn. 3:13 is of the same terms i.e. Christ being first fruits is the only bodily resurrection.

Best I can tell the Bible doesn't teach soul "sleep".

No, it doesn't teach that. That is true. From what I gather it teaches soul DEATH until the resurrection.

[Cross.eyed]

I have found a few scriptures that seem to imply that we don't go to heaven immediately when we die. The verse are Acts 2:29, and 34. I guess the question here is since David was a man after God's own heart, would he not be in heaven now? Or am I reading these verses wrong? Another verse would be John 3:13.

The greek word for sepulchre is mnaymion meaning grave (vs.29) Verse 34 refers to Davids body in resurrection, not his soul which is in heaven. Jn. 3:13 is of the same terms i.e. Christ being first fruits is the only bodily resurrection.

Best I can tell the Bible doesn't teach soul "sleep".

No, it doesn't teach that. That is true. From what I gather it teaches soul DEATH until the resurrection.

I'm unclear how you have reached that conclusion. My own studies-with commentaries and other books-tell the oppisite: The soul goes to heaven to be judged for rewards. Christ took captivity captive from the compartment of paradise. Paradise now being empty and sheol still being used.
Soul DEATH neither fits logically, what would be the purpose of killing the soul that would lie in state until the bodily resurrection?
Remember how Abraham was able to converse with the rich man?

Please bear in mind, I'm not arguing with you I just can't understand why GOD wouldn't want us with him nor can I find any evidence to the contrary.