The Trinity, tradition or scripture?

General discussions about Christianity including salvation, heaven and hell, Christian history and so on.
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jenna
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Re: The Trinity, tradition or scripture?

#196

Post by jenna » Wed Feb 06, 2008 8:57 pm

B. W. wrote:
jenna wrote:The reason I have not responded to this is simply because I cannot share my views without being considered heretical on this board. I do believe what Mr. Armstrong taught, however, my main reason for coming here was not to push my beliefs on others. I state my beliefs and why I believe them. I'm not trying to change other's minds on their beliefs, merely stating why I believe what I do, and why. i feel that if I don't agree with others here, I get censored. Isn't this a board open to Christian beliefs? Why is it then that everything I post gets attacked in some way? I understand that it is not me personally that is being argued, but my views on things. However, no one here seems to realize that it is hard for me to separate the two. I feel I cannot openly express my views without being chastened in some way. That being said, God bless everyone here.
Hi Jen we appreciate your candor. However, under Christ call we are called to contend for the faith — not be polite and let those known who have taught heretical anti-Christian doctrine have their say as what they say leads other astray.

Jude 1:3, “Beloved, although I was very eager to write to you about our common salvation, I found it necessary to write appealing to you to contend for the faith that was once for all delivered to the saints. 4 For certain people have crept in unnoticed who long ago were designated for this condemnation, ungodly people, who pervert the grace of our God into sensuality and deny our only Master and Lord, Jesus Christ.”

Mr. Herbert Armstrong was one of those who perverted the Christian faith, perverted grace as well, and promoted contrary teaching to supplant the fundamentals of the Christian faith with his own. He attempted to do so with the Doctrine of the Trinity in the 'Family' ideology which is more akin to ancient Greek Philosophy and pagan religious systems than with Orthodox Christian Doctrine on the Trinity.

We appreciate your sincerity but you must also understand that we do contend for the faith as peoples eternal state is at stake. There are others here that can expound more fully than I can, regarding Mr. Armstrong's teaching on his anti-Trinitarian 'Family of God' doctrine.

If you choose to proceed — several quick questions: Will you accept the truth of the bible over Mr. Armstrong? Is your love, faith, and devotion based solely on Mr. Herbert Armstrong or upon the real Jesus Christ? Would you be defending Mr. Armstrong or Christ?

No one here hates you. In fact we love you and our love is not afraid to chastise in the manner proscribed in:

Jude 1:23 “…save others by snatching them out of the fire; to others show mercy with fear, hating even the garment stained by the flesh.” ESV

2 Peter 3:17-18, “You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, take care that you are not carried away with the error of lawless people and lose your own stability. 18 But grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To him be the glory both now and to the day of eternity. Amen.
” ESV

God's Love is not defined as tolerance. A mother loves her child is not tolerant if her child wants to dine on rat-poison nor is she tolerant of a child molester desiring to use her child. Love will fight to the death to protect her young. Love is not tolerance.

You quoted this passage form the book of John - are you referring to Christ Jesus or Mr. Armstrong? No one is persecuting you on this thread. We understand what rat poison can do and will contend for the life of the bride of Christ…

"If the world hates you, you know that it hated Me before it hated you. If they persecuted Me, they will also persecute you." John 15:18, 20
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1)I accept the truth of the bible.
2)My love, faith and devotion does not belong to any man, but to Christ. It is Him alone I worship.
3)I will be defending the bible, not Mr. Armstrong.
Going back to question #1, I realize that my reply here may cause offense, if it does, well then you have taken it wrongly. I mean no offense when I say that I will not take any man's word over that of the bible. Not yours, or anyone else's. On any point. I am here to defend what the bible truly says. I will not provide anymore links to any church, if you wish. I will read what you post, honestly and openly. I can only ask the same from anyone else. As for my quote of John, I was mainly speaking of myself when I quoted this. I definitely feel persecuted sometimes, because I believe differently than most, if not all, of the people here. I do not feel hated, just misunderstood. I should not feel worried that if I feel the need to chastise out of love, as you do, that I will be banned or not welcome.
some things are better left unsaid, which i generally realize after i have said them

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B. W.
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Re: The Trinity, tradition or scripture?

#197

Post by B. W. » Wed Feb 06, 2008 10:05 pm

jenna wrote:...1)I accept the truth of the bible.
2)My love, faith and devotion does not belong to any man, but to Christ. It is Him alone I worship.
3)I will be defending the bible, not Mr. Armstrong.
Going back to question #1, I realize that my reply here may cause offense, if it does, well then you have taken it wrongly. I mean no offense when I say that I will not take any man's word over that of the bible. Not yours, or anyone else's. On any point. I am here to defend what the bible truly says. I will not provide anymore links to any church, if you wish. I will read what you post, honestly and openly. I can only ask the same from anyone else. As for my quote of John, I was mainly speaking of myself when I quoted this. I definitely feel persecuted sometimes, because I believe differently than most, if not all, of the people here. I do not feel hated, just misunderstood. I should not feel worried that if I feel the need to chastise out of love, as you do, that I will be banned or not welcome.
Well Jen, remember - you do not need to do this. The Old Testament is filled with references to the Trinity. Before you begin please think again.

Take the time to read each chapter of the Old Testament and everywhere the word God is translated, Lord, Jehovah, Yahweh, God, God Most High etc and etc — color code these words to the Strong's Number used for each word — God would be 430, 410 — Lord, - Jehovah, -Yahweh — 3068 etc and etc. This takes time to do and would cause you to really get into the scripture. It also helps you discover how the Trinity was and is revealed in the OT.

I did this years ago and it is wonderful help uncovering biblical truths about God. You would greatly benefit from doing this too.

God Bless and please — you do not have to proceed...
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Science is man's invention - creation is God's
(by B. W. Melvin)

Old Polish Proverb:
Not my Circus....not my monkeys

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Re: The Trinity, tradition or scripture?

#198

Post by jenna » Thu Feb 07, 2008 10:55 pm

What exactly is it that I do not have to do? What should I think about before proceeding? :econfused:
some things are better left unsaid, which i generally realize after i have said them

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Re: The Trinity, tradition or scripture?

#199

Post by B. W. » Sat Feb 09, 2008 9:21 am

jenna wrote:What exactly is it that I do not have to do? What should I think about before proceeding? :econfused:
This is what I did. I went through the entire Old Testament and drew a circle around every word where God was translated from Elohim (430-Strongs) was used. At the same time I marked brackets around the word God where it was translated from EL (410-Strongs). I underlined where Yahweh was used — then marked all other words used for God in various ways so that when reading the OT, I could easily see what Hebrew word was used for God and how. It is a fascinating study. I you have a bible software program — a person can do this rather quickly but it still takes time.

God Bless
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Science is man's invention - creation is God's
(by B. W. Melvin)

Old Polish Proverb:
Not my Circus....not my monkeys

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