Talking to god

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Murray
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Talking to god

#1

Post by Murray » Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:20 am

Throughout the bible their are hundreds of referances of god directly talking to people such as abraham, moses, judah, paul, adam, eve, jesus, ect..
But why did he stop directly speaking to us in the sense of like appearing as a burning bush? Why does our modern world lack the amount of beyond rational explanation miracles that were ever so prevalent in the old and new testaments.
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Re: Talking to god

#2

Post by B. W. » Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:52 am

Murray wrote:Throughout the bible their are hundreds of referances of god directly talking to people such as abraham, moses, judah, paul, adam, eve, jesus, ect..
But why did he stop directly speaking to us in the sense of like appearing as a burning bush? Why does our modern world lack the amount of beyond rational explanation miracles that were ever so prevalent in the old and new testaments.
You answered your own question: beyond rational explanation and cannot accept that God does speak in various ways and means today...

Next, in the OT such miracles were rare as well too...
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Re: Talking to god

#3

Post by Murray » Mon Jun 27, 2011 9:59 am

B. W. wrote:
Murray wrote:Throughout the bible their are hundreds of referances of god directly talking to people such as abraham, moses, judah, paul, adam, eve, jesus, ect..
But why did he stop directly speaking to us in the sense of like appearing as a burning bush? Why does our modern world lack the amount of beyond rational explanation miracles that were ever so prevalent in the old and new testaments.
You answered your own question: beyond rational explanation and cannot accept that God does speak in various ways and means today...

Next, in the OT such miracles were rare as well too...
So, are you saying there is no reason why god stopped doing these beyond rational explanaion miracles"?
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Re: Talking to god

#4

Post by B. W. » Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:00 am

Murray wrote:
B. W. wrote:
Murray wrote:Throughout the bible their are hundreds of references of god directly talking to people such as abraham, moses, judah, paul, adam, eve, Jesus, etc..
But why did he stop directly speaking to us in the sense of like appearing as a burning bush? Why does our modern world lack the amount of beyond rational explanation miracles that were ever so prevalent in the old and new testaments.
You answered your own question: beyond rational explanation and cannot accept that God does speak in various ways and means today...

Next, in the OT such miracles were rare as well too...
So, are you saying there is no reason why god stopped doing these beyond rational explanation miracles"?
No - it is because human beings seek rational explanations to explain away any and all miracles. For example, the greatest miracle viewed by all mortal human beings to this very day and that is this earth and universe. Human beings seek and design rational explanations for what they see and thus deny the creator’s greatest proof of his miraculous undertaking. (Romans 1:20, 21c)
-
-
-
Science is man's invention - creation is God's
(by B. W. Melvin)

Old Polish Proverb:
Not my Circus....not my monkeys

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Re: Talking to god

#5

Post by Murray » Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:45 am

B. W. wrote:
Murray wrote:
B. W. wrote:
Murray wrote:Throughout the bible their are hundreds of references of god directly talking to people such as abraham, moses, judah, paul, adam, eve, Jesus, etc..
But why did he stop directly speaking to us in the sense of like appearing as a burning bush? Why does our modern world lack the amount of beyond rational explanation miracles that were ever so prevalent in the old and new testaments.
You answered your own question: beyond rational explanation and cannot accept that God does speak in various ways and means today...

Next, in the OT such miracles were rare as well too...
So, are you saying there is no reason why god stopped doing these beyond rational explanation miracles"?
No - it is because human beings seek rational explanations to explain away any and all miracles. For example, the greatest miracle viewed by all mortal human beings to this very day and that is this earth and universe. Human beings seek and design rational explanations for what they see and thus deny the creator’s greatest proof of his miraculous undertaking. (Romans 1:20, 21c)
-
-
-
Do you believe that god does not want us to attept to explain this amazing creation that he has made? I mean the universe is a truly amazing and beautiful thing, I believe god wants us to explore it and attempt to explain it. However I do agree with you on the topic of we rationalize to much, we must always realize that it was originally gods doing.
Last edited by Murray on Mon Jun 27, 2011 2:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Talking to god

#6

Post by Byblos » Mon Jun 27, 2011 12:07 pm

Murray wrote:Do you believe that god does not want us to attept to explain this amazing creation that he has made? I mean the universe is a truly amazing and beatiful thing, I believe god wants us to explore it and attempt to explain it. However I do agree with you on the topic of we rationalize to much, we must always realize that it was origonally gods doing.
This is why I have a huge problem with atheists (the likes of Dawkins for example) who go on claiming that theists undermine science when they invoke a creator. As if this creator gave us the ability to reason to then turn around and make us withhold its use. God is the creator of all, including science and reason. It is no wonder that they are both converging more than ever before towards Him.
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Re: Talking to god

#7

Post by SatisfiedAtheist » Thu Jun 30, 2011 4:20 pm

There is no good evidence that ANY of that was beyond mere natural hallucinations, self-hypnosis, and perceptual distortions. The human brain is disproportionally large for our body. While this obviously gives us the ability to fathom what is far beyond our direct experience, it carries a huge cost: Our imagination can run wild beyond control. The same brain that lets us get to the moon can manufacture complicated tales and convince itself they are real.

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Re: Talking to god

#8

Post by Murray » Fri Jul 01, 2011 9:11 am

SatisfiedAtheist wrote:There is no good evidence that ANY of that was beyond mere natural hallucinations, self-hypnosis, and perceptual distortions. The human brain is disproportionally large for our body. While this obviously gives us the ability to fathom what is far beyond our direct experience, it carries a huge cost: Our imagination can run wild beyond control. The same brain that lets us get to the moon can manufacture complicated tales and convince itself they are real.

What you said makes no sense and explains nothing, it was a derogative statement meant to be taken offensively, there is not a sliver of evidence against such things, perhaps you should talk to atheist who used to be exactly like you and was changed by experiences such as NDEs. How do you use logic and reason to explain this, in the 18th century, 2 men has an NDE, the 2 men wrote books about their experience,(note this is before any way of fast communication), and the fascinating thing is, they were almost identical. Now you might try to say this was self imposed hypnosis, now that makes no sense. In order for one to experience the same self imposed hypnosis as another, you would need the same person directing your hypnosis, but in this case it is 2 different people which makes it highly unlikely that 2 people can have derive the same self hypnosis with such similarities. Now that is using logic and reason, but saying well everything is just a big coincidence is not logic and reason.
Last edited by Murray on Fri Jul 01, 2011 2:37 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Talking to god

#9

Post by Seraph » Fri Jul 01, 2011 11:05 am

SatisfiedAtheist wrote:There is no good evidence that ANY of that was beyond mere natural hallucinations, self-hypnosis, and perceptual distortions. The human brain is disproportionally large for our body. While this obviously gives us the ability to fathom what is far beyond our direct experience, it carries a huge cost: Our imagination can run wild beyond control. The same brain that lets us get to the moon can manufacture complicated tales and convince itself they are real.
There really is no substance here aside from "we have imaginations, therefore God is imaginary". Not exactly a bulletproof philosophical arguement.

I guess we would be silly to believe in atoms or physical laws or any claims of knowledge since our silly imaginations get the best of us when we do so.
I am committed to belief in God, as the most morally demanding, psychologically enriching, intellectually satisfying and imaginatively fruitful hypothesis about the ultimate nature of reality known to me - Keith Ward

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Re: Talking to god

#10

Post by Danieltwotwenty » Fri Jul 01, 2011 5:55 pm

Hi
I dont know about anyone else, but my experience when i am stuck on what to reply to somone about what i beleive etc... i pray a lot and ask God for guidance.
Sometimes after much praying ( sometimes days later )its like the answer explodes into my head and all becomes clear and i know what to say.
I beleive this is God speaking to me, because i know that the answer did not come from my mind as it was a sudden realisation and it felt like someone speaking to me.
I have never seen a burning bush etc... but i have had many experiences that i cannot explain.
In conclusion i beleive that God does still speak to us in a very real way.

Your Friend
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1Tim1:15-17
Here is a trustworthy saying that deserves full acceptance: Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners of whom I am the worst. But for that very reason I was shown mercy so that in me, the worst of sinners, Christ Jesus might display his immense patience as an example for those who would believe in him and receive eternal life. Now to the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only God, be honor and glory for ever and ever.Amen.

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Re: Talking to god

#11

Post by spartanII » Fri Aug 05, 2011 9:18 am

Byblos wrote:
Murray wrote:Do you believe that god does not want us to attept to explain this amazing creation that he has made? I mean the universe is a truly amazing and beatiful thing, I believe god wants us to explore it and attempt to explain it. However I do agree with you on the topic of we rationalize to much, we must always realize that it was origonally gods doing.
This is why I have a huge problem with atheists (the likes of Dawkins for example) who go on claiming that theists undermine science when they invoke a creator. As if this creator gave us the ability to reason to then turn around and make us withhold its use. God is the creator of all, including science and reason. It is no wonder that they are both converging more than ever before towards Him.
I agree. And once you get done to it. To the very cell itself, Dawkins does admit "well maybe that implies there is a creator," but then shrugs it off with another following statement: "or perhaps, it was aliens,"

:pound:

--yeah, real scientific analysis there--

have you ever seen these aliens, touched them, smelled them, tasted them, heard them?
Man, that makes them go in the same man-made idea basket that the tooth fairy, God, and Santa Claus is in.
Atheist: "Science says it, I believe it, That settles it."

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