Christianity and Islam

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Christianity and Islam

#1

Post by kmr » Thu Jun 09, 2011 6:51 pm

Have any of you noticed that Christianity and Islam are very similar? I mean, they are the two largest religions, both believe in universal conversion, both say that belief in God is the way to heaven (or, in some cases, observing the Five Pillars or Sacraments) and (mostly) that their way is the only way to heaven. Did anyone else make this connection? What do you think, it seems to me that Islam, a lifestyle that is so often in conflict with Christianity, is the closest to Christianity in terms of beliefs. What do you think? y:-/
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Re: Christianity and Islam

#2

Post by RickD » Thu Jun 09, 2011 7:34 pm

kmr wrote:Have any of you noticed that Christianity and Islam are very similar? I mean, they are the two largest religions, both believe in universal conversion, both say that belief in God is the way to heaven (or, in some cases, observing the Five Pillars or Sacraments) and (mostly) that their way is the only way to heaven. Did anyone else make this connection? What do you think, it seems to me that Islam, a lifestyle that is so often in conflict with Christianity, is the closest to Christianity in terms of beliefs. What do you think? y:-/
I think if you really believe Islam and Christianity are really similar, you really don't know too much about either. Islam is similar to other religions that are based on a "works" type of system where man is trying to reach up to God. Christianity alone, is God reaching down to man.
John 5:24
24 “Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.

Kenny wrote:
"You don’t need faith, logic, reason, proof, or anything else to be atheist, all you need to do is reject what someone told you."



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Re: Christianity and Islam

#3

Post by kmr » Thu Jun 09, 2011 10:16 pm

I agree completely, I just thought that a lot of the lesser philosophies of Islam are similar to Christianity...?
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Re: Christianity and Islam

#4

Post by neo-x » Thu Jun 09, 2011 10:56 pm

Islam sounds similar to Christianity but it is far from it. Be in no delusion about it.

differences in Islam and Christianity, I'm listing the major ones.

1. they believe that Satan was not a fallen angel but a Jinn, that Satan was thrown down to earth not because he was arrogant but because he refused to bow to Adam, which God commanded him to do.

2. Adam and eve were not in Eden but in paradise.

3. Eve was never promised redemption as in genesis 3

4. Ishmael, not Issac was the promised son.

5. No prophet ever committed any error or sin of any kind, no body ever got drunk or misbehaved, never lied, no nothing nada.

6. All prophets were Muslim. (without any historical support)

7. The Bible and all other scriptures were modified and changed by men that is why the Quran was given, because man edited them with their own man made theories.

8. Jesus was not the son of God. There is no trinity, God has no son, no holy spirit either.

9. Jesus was never crucified.

10. Jesus was never buried and so never risen from the dead.

11. Redemption is through good works and not grace and God's eternal love.

12. There is no redemption for the sinner, God only loves the pious, not the sinner.

13. Women are not subject to equality.

14. Polygamy is allowed and encouraged.

15. Divorce is allowed in any circumstances unlike Christianity.

16. No person other than a Muslim can be the authority of the state, no non-Muslim can have a seat above a Muslim.

17. There can be no democracy, only a dictatorship or caliphate system is allowed.

18. Those who refuse to be Muslim should be charged money if they chose to stay in a Muslim area.

19. Marriage to the Quran can be done if someone wants to keep a celibacy.

20. The punishments are severe, for theft, cutting of hands, for adultery, either the whore is to be whipped/flogged or stoned.

21. Woman can never be priests or leaders, either in the state or in the mosque.

22. Quran 5:51 explicitly tells Muslims that the Jews and Christians can never be their friends or allies.

23. Muhammad is the last prophet and is greater than any prophet before.

23. There can be no prophets after Muhammad.

24. There can be no miracles today, all the revelation is to be from the Quran.

25. The quran has 6666 versus, some versions have 6352, the Bible has almost 31000 verses in the standard KJV alone. The result is that quran summarizes a lot of things and doesn't give any details.

26. You must do a wazoo before you do a numaaz (prayer), wash, you hands and feet, your nose, inside of your nose, you face etc etc.

27. If you yawn or fart in a prayer, you have to repeat/recite wazoo and all of the prayer again.

28. The fasting is mandatory.

29. Marriage for one night is allowed, that is if you really like a women besides your wife and spend a night with her. The next day you can divorce her. She has not right or claim to anything.

30. Painting and photography is banned, so is illustration, this may wary in some sects but the ground rule remains the same.

31. Women should not see the face of any stranger.

32. There is even a method for a bath, which is considered holy as the prophet himself took it that way.

33. Killing in the name of honor, in the name of the prophet or blasphemy is allowed.

34. An eye for an eye, unlike Christianity which says, turn the other cheek.

There may be many more, I have just jotted down a few major ones. So I would say these two are common as much as two persons both having the name John, but their face, color, complexion, likes and dislike, personality, all and everything will differ.
It would be a blessing if they missed the cairns and got lost on the way back. Or if
the Thing on the ice got them tonight.

I could only turn and stare in horror at the chief surgeon.
Death by starvation is a terrible thing, Goodsir, continued Stanley.
And with that we went below to the flame-flickering Darkness of the lower deck
and to a cold almost the equal of the Dante-esque Ninth Circle Arctic Night
without.


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Re: Christianity and Islam

#5

Post by Grizz_1 » Sat Jun 11, 2011 6:34 am

I had copied this from somewhere? I don't remember where. lol but It may explain some of what you ask.

"You might wonder how it is that the writings of Islam, such as the Koran, have prophetic writings at all as we Christians in the West do not believe that they are inspired by the one true God. But when you research how it was that Mohammad received his revelations, it becomes clear who it was that provided the dictation for Islamic holy writings. For we are told that there appeared to Mohammad a bright angel dressed in white and declared to him that he was to be a prophet to the Arab people and that he was to faithfully record all the words of this messenger ‘from God’. When we hear this immediately light bulbs go on in our heads and we remember that it was the serpent that beguiled Eve through his subtlety, and no marvel; “…for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.” 2 Cor 11:3,14 (KJV)

The devil knows the Book of Revelation back-ways and upside down and must hate this book above all others. And why wouldn’t he? After all, it deals with his demise and doom and eternal damnation. So he would need to know it thoroughly in order to try to subvert it in any way he could so as to avert his own final outcome. Thus, as master counterfeiter and as an angel of light, his prophecies will closely mirror the truth of the scriptures and at the same time fit his own plans to deceive the world and cause the complete destruction of man. Therefore it is no wonder to us that other prophecies  from non Christian sources would reflect many of the truths of the Word of God, for they were obviously devised by Satan to deceive and delivered by either himself or his representatives who, “masquerade as ministers of  righteousness”. 2 Cor 11:15 (NIV). There is no surprise, therefore, that Islamic holy writings contain prophesies that are similar to those of the true Word of God."

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Re: Christianity and Islam

#6

Post by kmr » Sat Jun 11, 2011 11:52 pm

Okay, I take it back, it looks like it is only similar on the surface. Thanks!
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Re: Christianity and Islam

#7

Post by Katabole » Mon Jun 13, 2011 9:53 am

My biggest problem with Islam is their claim that as Neo pointed out:
neo-x wrote:23. Muhammad is the last prophet and is greater than any prophet before.
As Jesus makes clear:

Matt 11:11 (KJV) Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.

Luke 7:28 (KJV) For I say unto you, Among those that are born of women there is not a greater prophet than John the Baptist: but he that is least in the kingdom of God is greater than he.

Matt 11:13 (KJV) For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.

There are those that claim that there are prophets within the church, basing it on 1Cor 12:

1Cor 12:28 (KJV) And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues.

However, the word 'prophets' here should be read as "inspired speakers", which as church history shows, God has done what He said and set those in the church. Even today, there are quite a number of inspired speakers. But this is not a reference to a continuation of the Old Testament prophets. When Jesus says that John the Baptist was the last and greatest prophet and that the prophets prophecied until John, you can take that to the bank!

There will come a time when sons and daughters will prophesy as spoken in the book of Joel, but that is not the same as someone like Jeremiah who was ordained a prophet while still in his mother's womb. Some may prophesy, that is, they will make prophetic utterance, but that doesn't make them prophets.

John the Baptist was the last and greatest prophet. There were to be no more. I don't believe Muhammad was a prophet of God whatsoever. A false prophet? Most defintely. Therefore for me, Islam is a false religion and an ideaology created to try and destroy the salvation that Christ manifested.

I do have a copy of the Koran at home though. But I use it only as historical reference to exemplify how Christianity is true.
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Re: Christianity and Islam

#8

Post by Gman » Mon Jun 13, 2011 10:19 pm

kmr wrote:Have any of you noticed that Christianity and Islam are very similar? I mean, they are the two largest religions, both believe in universal conversion, both say that belief in God is the way to heaven (or, in some cases, observing the Five Pillars or Sacraments) and (mostly) that their way is the only way to heaven. Did anyone else make this connection? What do you think, it seems to me that Islam, a lifestyle that is so often in conflict with Christianity, is the closest to Christianity in terms of beliefs. What do you think? y:-/
Christianity and Islam are about as opposite as you can get.. Extreme opposites.. Any person who says they are similar has probably not read the doctrines or has a reading disorder.. Seriously. It is beyond silliness to say that the Muslims and Christians worship the same God and yet we have people with PHD's who say that they are the same. They are not true intellectuals.
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Re: Christianity and Islam

#9

Post by Murray » Wed Jun 15, 2011 4:51 pm

Islam was created as a way for general muhamad to gain recruits into his conquering army and as a means to control those territoires he conquered.

Christianity was created by god to give the gift of eternal life to all gods children
in nomine patri et fili spiritu sancte

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Re: Christianity and Islam

#10

Post by neo-x » Wed Jun 15, 2011 9:59 pm

Guys, I was having a debate on a blog a Muslim wrote a an article on "10 misconceptions about islam", here are some excerpts to which I responded. i applogize for the long post. Hope it helps

He wrote the below...you can read the full article at http://insider.pk/life-style/religion/c ... out-islam/, My comments are under the name John A. David.

Article Points
Misconception # 1: Violence and Terrorism is the Muslim Creed

Misconception #2: Jihad Means Killing Non-Muslims

Misconception #3: Women are Oppressed in Islam
If we look into how other major religions look at women, we will find surprising revelations. In the New Testament, St. Paul declares, “A woman should learn in quietness and full submission. I don’t permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent. For Adam was formed first, then Eve. And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner.” In contrast, this is what Qur’an has to say, “Whoever works righteousness, man or woman, and has faith, verily to him/her we will give a new life that is good and pure, and we will bestow on such their reward according to the best of their actions.” (16:97)


Misconception #4: Muslims don’t Believe in Jesus

Misconception #5: Propagation of Islam is the result of Force

Misconception #6: Islam is Intolerant of Other Religions

Misconception #7: Muslims are Savages with no Regard for Culture and Civilization

Misconception #8: Islam was founded by Muhammad (peace be upon him)

Misconception #9: At least Four Wives for Muslim Men

Misconception #10: The Crescent and Star is the Symbol of Islam
My responses
While I agree with you that you can find bad people in every religion and the mass actions of a religious gathering doesn’t always mean that their religion says or promotes it, Islam tends to have a higher percentage of the said bad people. Now I’m no way saying that there is something inherently bad in the Muslim people itself but it is quite hard to overlook the fact that Muslims tend to be militant the very instant they have a reason. It is kind of a priority action even when the reason could be addressed via other means.

I know a lot Muslims who would rather spit on my face than eat with me. I find this troubling because Muslims are trying their best to enter in the non-Muslim countries where they enjoy the privileges but sadly they have a looter mentality, the same that Europeans had when they first started colonizing Americas. They are trying to take over in a very strange weird kind of way. I have been thinking about this for some time now and I figured that the whole problems is in your teaching process. May be it is the interpretations or the opinion of the Mullah but nonetheless there is a planted bias towards others from a small age. Now I hate cliches but just for reference

5:51
“O ye who believe! take not the Jews and the Christians for your friends: They are but friends to each other. And he amongst you that turns to them is of them. Verily Allah guideth not a people unjust.”

Now however you may look at it, historically or literally (even if you cite a different tafseer), when you teach a child who is in his 1st or 2nd grade and recite him this verse, what do you expect him to learn from it? of course no child is taught in their infancy the tafseer, and this is just one example, there are others which i haven’t touched. When a young mind absorbs this kind of hate, they are bound to grow with a certain bias. And I am afraid this is the kind of problem that Muslims are facing throughout the world.

The Quran has verses that can be translated and swayed both ways and I suppose this is something that no one can really control, every Holy Book, the bible or quran have versus that can be used against their own meaning but Muslims are frantically turning fanatics or militant and as a result now the rest of the world is returning that favor. it is just all bad. more hate and hate.

About your article, I would just say that women do not have equal rights to men in Islam, they just have some rights. the property they inherit is not equal to a male. you should have mentioned that. As far as property in other religions is concerned, ancient Persia, Greece, Rome and Egypt and even the Jews also had rights for women including will and property, so this is not something very spectacular or new that only Islam produced. It was certainly something new for the Bedouins, because they were real savages. But not to the rest of the world.

You have taken the new testament verse to cite an example, but may i remind you that you are grossly mistaken. first women in Islam are forbidden to have a role in religious leadership, they can’t be an Imam, can they? second when Paul was writing this to the church – which were converts from the Greek and were famous for their female priests. Their religious practices prior to becoming Christian was to perform idol worship and engage in immoral acts since that was the crux of Greek worship. Keeping this in mind Paul wrote them that the women in that church should not dictate others what to do or how to worship since they do not know and will probably mislead others so they should learn. so please dig into a reference before you use it for the wrong purpose. Christians have a very high number of female pastors, evangelists and other religious roles.

About point 8: Islam was founded by Muhammad, Islam did not exist prior to that. there is not proof of what you are saying. i suggest you take history’s view. Jesus wasn’t Muslim, no matter how you come about it, you cant prove it. And Muhammad himself said he was commended by Allah to be the First Muslim. Given your knowledge it wont be hard to fetch that verse “…have I been commanded: I am THE FIRST MOSLEM” 6:14.

About the question of four wives, may I ask you why the women aren’t allowed to 4 marriages? why men alone? It is actually not your fault Absar, so I can see how you will answer this. But then please do not say that women have equal rights. That makes all of your hard reasoning a hypocrite stance. Though I am sure that is not your intention.

the Prophet and Ali had more wives than four upto 13 or some source cite Ali had 18 wives, why? are these gentlemen above the law of quran or Allah. I know the usual response that it was done out of charity, but please, you can also make somebody a daughter, do you have to make her your own bride in order to safe gaurd her? I dont see that as necessary. Not to mention Ayesha was wedded when she was below 10 years old. can you throw some light to it. is this normal behavior? can you wed a 7 or 8 year old girl? does the quran allow it? I hope you see the contradiction I am trying to point out. Islam has some real problems when these facts are pointed out.

One more question, can you tell me how Muhammed married Khadija before the advent of islam or quran, He was 25, khadija was forty, what Nikkah ceremony did they perform. It certainly wasn’t a muslim nikkah since there was no imam or quran, in fact the prophet himself had not seen any angel or heard a “wahi” at that age. So how did they marry? who performed the nikkah? and what religious nikkah was used? and mind you Khadija was a Jew.
I do not agree with your definition of Muslim, while in the literal sense anyone could be a Muslim if they follow the definition you provided, but strictly a Muslim would be who accepts Allah and believes that Muhammad is the last prophet. this is the definition that Islam provides and by this, no one else except Muhammad was the first Muslim.
The view about women is not right, it makes her inferior even if you say it is equal. but i understand from where you are coming. Your book teaches you that, obviously you will be thinking it as right. The laws of sharia are problematic in today’s society. the fact is that the sharia was written for Bedouins, most of the laws only apply to them or their immediate culture. Even a lot of modern day Islamic scholars which are more liberal think that such laws were biased in the favor of man ruling society.

For the mention of wives having multiple husbands, i know that it is not a very ideal setup, but the point was given for the sake of argument of equal rights, nothing more.
In my personal study I have found the Ahdiat’s to be very contradictory to out right against the core aspects of Islam, yet only some are counted as authentic among some hundreds of thousands. I would rather have a verse from Quran than ten Ahadiats because they were later written and upon witnesses, that is a huge question on authenticity itself. Anyways about Ali you should read I think he had more than 4 at a given time.
About Khadija, the seera does not state her religion, only her tribe, but that tribe was idol worshipers. contradictory evidence suggests that she was Jew or at least close to Christian since upon hearing about the angel she took Muhammad to Waraqa bin Neufel, who was a Christian converted from Jews. My point was that if the prophet was not idol worshiper he must have married Khadija using some nikkah, but it could not have been a Muslim nikkah. since you claim he never did anything remotely wrong, i wonder if marrying through a different nikkah is counted as wrong or is the prophet given the benefit again and is allowed to do so, even if the nikkah was Jewish, Christian or pagan.
AGAIN About their prophet marrying a six year old girl
about marriage to ayesha, i was saying in the present world such practice is abhorrent, none the less it is still carried out. there were criticisms on Muhammad’s marriages and mostly among the Muslims in his time but later verses revealed that he was allowed. those who probably didn’t conform to this were either ruled out of favor or silenced by force. you can read about it in the seera’s of mulana madoodi and shabli nomani too, however i am just going by memory here.
About marriage of Ayesha at such a young age, even though it may be the usual custom of that time and you respect that, that is fine, since it is your book and your teachings. I however do not agree with it, marrying a six year old, to me does not seem normal in any circumstances. If you say the prophet was as good as he was then he surely must have seen the implication and what kind of example was he leaving behind for others. But again, you have your reasons and since you do not object to that, the point of debating the fact dies for this particular point.
Last edited by neo-x on Thu Jun 16, 2011 12:41 am, edited 2 times in total.
It would be a blessing if they missed the cairns and got lost on the way back. Or if
the Thing on the ice got them tonight.

I could only turn and stare in horror at the chief surgeon.
Death by starvation is a terrible thing, Goodsir, continued Stanley.
And with that we went below to the flame-flickering Darkness of the lower deck
and to a cold almost the equal of the Dante-esque Ninth Circle Arctic Night
without.


//johnadavid.wordpress.com

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Re: Christianity and Islam

#11

Post by neo-x » Wed Jun 15, 2011 10:03 pm

On their claim, Islam is a religion of peace.
...you are a servant to Allah. And if so you have no will, a servant doesn’t have one. Whatever the will of the master so shall be the will of the slave. This is not a fundamentally wrong association if we are to look at it peacefully, but in a militant mentality this type of reasoning produces what today Islam is facing, a pure left hand radical Islam. And I sometimes wonder peace loving Muslims like your self must be worried. No one is safe from these kind of idiots. Anyone who kills in the name of pleasing God is a fool.

But tell me, when someone says something against Muhammad, Muslims do charge Fatwa’s, orders of killing that said person under the blasphemy is supported from almost everyone, Ahadiat’s are quoted, etc etc. If you are truly peace loving people of book then stop evil practices like this. no one should have the authority to judge a man on his opinion or views. No one is above the book. And in that case, even no prophet is above the book or God. if killing in the name of God is wrong, then killing in the name of your prophet is preposterous. I am baffled when people come up with idiot logical reasons to support the idea of honor killings and killing someone for blasphemy.

I AM IN NO WAY SAYING THAT ANY PROPHET OR GOD SHOULD BE MOCKED OR MADE FUN OF. BUT IF YOU ARE TRULY LOVING AND PEACEFUL THEN YOU SHOULD TOLERATE IT AND OBJECT WITHIN A LIMIT OF HUMANITY AND JUSTICE. I KNOW A LOT OF MUSLIMS WHO MOCK CHRISTIANITY, A LOT OF ATHEISTS WHO OPENLY MOCK OUR PROPHETS AND GOD. BUT I AM IN NO WAY GOING TO KILL THEM FOR IT. LET GOD DECIDE THEIR FATE. WE ARE BUT MEN ONLY.

But here is the dilemma, such values of tolerance are only in a democratic society. Islam is not democracy, it has its own sharia rule and in that you are to follow it without questions. So the moral choice is no more resting in the humanitarian cause but rather a religious cause. And I have heard many times the argument given for the brutal Arabic laws and how they are very useful in detaining crime and other things but then it clashes with peace and loving religion, a religion that forgives and unites. well let me tell you, it only unites the strong, the weak it doesn’t. according to sharia a person convicted of theft should have his hand(s) cut off. the prostitute, if caught should be whipped. Tell me is this your love and unity and peace. This is totalitarian-ism and this is what is causing trouble. And now some one can say that such practices reduce crime, yes they do, but at what cost? imposed will. if a person who made a theft has had his hands cut off, what do you think he lost, he not only lost his hands, he lost his way of earning and going back. even if he repents, what can he do with disability. can he be a normal citizen again? No. You can say he will never steal again, yeah sure, but he won;t be able to do any other thing as well.

Now don’t take me wrong, this is not a debate about capital punishment or anything like that, the law of the state is made with vote of the people. of people agree that some law is not right than they could amend, improve or change it. However when a law is brought from a religious book like quran, it is unquestionable and objective, you can’t change it. it is god’s will or something like that. and you will have to carry it out regardless of your own moral position in the matter. You with me? it is like being in a box, you can’t go out of without the possibility of being charged as a heretic. Man made laws can always be challenged, but you will not challenge your book, even if sounds wrong. this is the mentality that broods militancy and injustice in Islam. You can’t think objectively, you are told you follow and you can not go against the book or prophet.

Islam is for the strong, not for the weak, it doesn’t grant forgiveness, neither does it offers a path for redemption. if you screwed up, your problem, you reap what you sow, fine. But then please do not sugar coat it, do not make it sound like “love all” kind of thing. it doesn’t fit, Islam contradicts it self on a theological level when such contrary statements are produced.

And here is the problem, if you are a peace loving person and you are a Muslim, would you follow the quran and cutoff the hands of a man, who (you have no way of knowing), may repent. or would you give him punishment in a humane way, but in doing so you will not be following Islam. and remember, in Islam you follow Allah’s will. and in this case you are to choose between your moral sense and a order of a book. I am interested to see how will you approach this. But even if you don’t, you do get my point? There are some fundamental problems in the way Islam teaches, it not humanist, it is a strict code, there are hardly any margins available.

This is the problem that peace loving good Muslims are facing from the extremists who take these orders word for word. Your idea of a peaceful, loving humanity is noble and well worth praise but Islam is sadly not perfect way to achieve this. In order for everyone to gather, they either must be all Muslim or else it is a democracy, but if Islam is the way that such a world state should be achieved that there is a problem. Islam doesn’t support democracy, it is not for everyone. Let me refer it to a point in the original article that Absar wrote. Why the Indians despite being under the Muslim rule, remained Hindus, his point was in support that Islam didn’t force religion by force or sword. And here is my point, even if I believe it that this is the way it happened that would mean that Hindus were least impressed by Islam, The majority despite being 800 years in servitude never converted.

I agree we can not undo history and so we should never alter or or sugar coat it to prove our points. I just showed you from some examples. Muslims are good people at large, but you need to change some things in understanding of your own book if you want people to see Islam as the religion you say it is.
It would be a blessing if they missed the cairns and got lost on the way back. Or if
the Thing on the ice got them tonight.

I could only turn and stare in horror at the chief surgeon.
Death by starvation is a terrible thing, Goodsir, continued Stanley.
And with that we went below to the flame-flickering Darkness of the lower deck
and to a cold almost the equal of the Dante-esque Ninth Circle Arctic Night
without.


//johnadavid.wordpress.com

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Re: Christianity and Islam

#12

Post by neo-x » Wed Jun 15, 2011 10:05 pm

On the claim that Islam is more tolerant
Open liberalism of Christianity in some way, is helpful too and more tolerant than Muslim states, for example, the last Pope allowed a mosque to be built in the Vatican city. But i am sure the Muslims wont allow a church in Mecca and Medina. The Saudi authorities adhere to the austere Wahhabi version of Sunni Islam, ruthlessly banning all non-Muslim religious rituals and confiscate Bibles and crucifixes.
It would be a blessing if they missed the cairns and got lost on the way back. Or if
the Thing on the ice got them tonight.

I could only turn and stare in horror at the chief surgeon.
Death by starvation is a terrible thing, Goodsir, continued Stanley.
And with that we went below to the flame-flickering Darkness of the lower deck
and to a cold almost the equal of the Dante-esque Ninth Circle Arctic Night
without.


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Re: Christianity and Islam

#13

Post by neo-x » Wed Jun 15, 2011 10:15 pm

About their claim that the Bible has changed
About the changing of the Bible, sadly you believe in myths without evidence. the oldest copies of the new testament are from the 1st century A.D, the first compiled collective Bible in the 4th century, both predates Islam. of course Muslims have to say that it was changed because lets be honest if you agree that they did not changed than historically you would have no reason to believe in a later book namely quran, so lets just say it is necessary statement for you rather than a true one. please also cite references of quran about the changing of Bible.

10:94
“If you doubt what We have revealed to you [Muhammad], Ask those who have read the Scriptures before you.”

if those scriptures had been changed why on earth would Allah tell your prophet to go to them. doesn’t make sense to me. remember this is the 6th century A.D. so if you say they were changed later then clearly you are misled and misinformed as I told you the oldest books of the Bible are dated (even carbon dated) to be before Islam and they are intact with what we have today. and if you say they were already changed than it is a contradiction. although the Bible would not need quran’s support to indicate authenticity since quran is younger and came centuries later but nonetheless it is a question for your part. Jesus clearly said in the N.T that the Bible can’t be changed, so go figure that out. I would trust the world of Jesus than quran. also be careful when you say statements like you the Bible is changed through history by whims of men, you may very well be wrong, since you have’t studied it or its history. read authenticated sources rather than googling up websites which may be biased, read earliest books before you make eligible claims, this is a humble suggestion. The bible is the most printed book in history, do you know what would happen if someone changed it, it will immediately be spotted. much like the quran. you can’t do such a thing, have you ever heard of any religion changing their own book because of unknown future events, change needs a motive, and on a global scale. everyone can not change the bible at the same time around the whole world and that those changes would be the same. It is idiotic to imagine in elephantine proportions. and a horrible thing to say without research into it.
It would be a blessing if they missed the cairns and got lost on the way back. Or if
the Thing on the ice got them tonight.

I could only turn and stare in horror at the chief surgeon.
Death by starvation is a terrible thing, Goodsir, continued Stanley.
And with that we went below to the flame-flickering Darkness of the lower deck
and to a cold almost the equal of the Dante-esque Ninth Circle Arctic Night
without.


//johnadavid.wordpress.com

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Re: Christianity and Islam

#14

Post by neo-x » Wed Jun 15, 2011 10:20 pm

about women and sex
Some of the surrah”s are filled with promises of women and sex for those who enter paradise, please read the surah’s about women and alcohol and teenage boys in paradise. read about the promises of 70 women, and then please tell me, what do you expect to do with these 70 women in paradise, in the presence of God, drinking alcohol. you surely wont be playing cards with them when one man is given the sexual stamina of 70 men or 100 men. if you are talking about newness than perhaps this is the only newness I found was that such sexual activity will be done in heaven, right under God’s nose. This is far from holy or moral.
...having sex and drinking alcohol in presence of God with 70 women, certainly is (an immoral stance)... It is what is you are promised. so do not try to say that it is only just because we have something similar. no sir, we do not have anything similar like this and thank God for that. God is holy. You can’t have sex in a place of worship on earth. How in all eternity do you plan to do it in the presence of God.

Tell me Do women also get 70 men in heaven or just one?

About Muslim expansions, it is in your own book, you do not need to rely on my lying teeth to know the truth, just open a history book, even of your own historians, and read. Do not rest on what they teach you in the standard text book, go beyond a little, so that you can assimilate more knowledge about your past, which might be true rather than fantasy fabricated accounts.
about polygamy
you have polygamy in your religion built in and encouraged, Christians don’t. of course we say it is unjust and immoral. it is not my teaching but my book. you obviously do not expect me to support polygamy. first it is unjust to women, second it creates problems. but you justifying polygamy is simply because you revere the man who had 13 wives, so I would say that it is natural that you defend it. but polygamy is not just and not ok, ask a moral woman, she will tell you better.

I mean your book allows a marriage for one night. on what grounds do you say it is more moral. Now the so called guardians of the faith and the book like the suadi’s even allowed and legalized a marriage for one night. and do not counter it with western examples of vulgarity and marriages and divorce because they are not from religion neither do they have any support from them. but the marriage for one night only is actually supported from your religion not from secular laws. we are not talking about people who follow their whims but what a religion teaches.
It would be a blessing if they missed the cairns and got lost on the way back. Or if
the Thing on the ice got them tonight.

I could only turn and stare in horror at the chief surgeon.
Death by starvation is a terrible thing, Goodsir, continued Stanley.
And with that we went below to the flame-flickering Darkness of the lower deck
and to a cold almost the equal of the Dante-esque Ninth Circle Arctic Night
without.


//johnadavid.wordpress.com

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Re: Christianity and Islam

#15

Post by neo-x » Wed Jun 15, 2011 10:23 pm

lol..finally one of them begin unethical tactics, personal insults and that was when i backed out of the argument, the last comment one posted was in support of the person who begin personal insults,
Plse remember that Satan was a great scholar. don’t waste your energy on a Kafir (this being me) bent to enter Hell. your explanations are crystal clear for everyone to understand except for the one who does not want to see.
Now what else can I say, he just supported me the best way possible. :ewink:
It would be a blessing if they missed the cairns and got lost on the way back. Or if
the Thing on the ice got them tonight.

I could only turn and stare in horror at the chief surgeon.
Death by starvation is a terrible thing, Goodsir, continued Stanley.
And with that we went below to the flame-flickering Darkness of the lower deck
and to a cold almost the equal of the Dante-esque Ninth Circle Arctic Night
without.


//johnadavid.wordpress.com

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