What is salvation

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The edge
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What is salvation

#1

Post by The edge » Sat May 07, 2005 7:16 am

what exactly is salvation?

To know that I'm a sinner & that there's a God & His son (also God) died for me & I will submit to him?

What if at the point of "salvation", I'd not understand/accepted the truth about Jesus virgin bith, the triune nature of God, his resurrection...am I still save at that juncture or would salvation only be accorded when I understand the above facts.

On repentance for salvation. Does it simply means that I know I've sin in certain areas, or must one be able to acknowledge all areas of sin as define outright (urder) or in principles (not harming our body thru smoking) in the bible before it's considered true repentance fit for salvation.

How much would one need to check if a person is genuinely saved before allowing/administering baptism?

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#2

Post by Dan » Sat May 07, 2005 9:29 am

This is how I see salvation:

Salvation is coming home one day, seeing your house torched to the ground and being arrested for arson. Being disowned by your parents and beaten by the local mob of angry housewives, and then being thrown in jail for the rest of your life to rot away. And still submitting to God and accepting His will and repenting for the sins you have commited. "I accept your will God, I accept how you direct my life. I submit to you in every aspect Christ, your will be done in the heavens and the earth. What you have done, what you are doing, and what you will do is perfectly fine with me. I just want to be forgiven for my sins."

Salvation is turning to God, no matter how hard the circumstances are, and relying on Him for support in every conceivable predicament.

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#3

Post by Prodigal Son » Sat May 07, 2005 9:47 am

salvation is having a relationship with God. you can believe in Him and accept Him and accept that you are a sinner...you can even follow His laws and still not have a relationship with Him.
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#4

Post by AttentionKMartShoppers » Sat May 07, 2005 11:09 am

Salvation requires you to accept Christ as Lord, repent, and turn to Him, so, in a matter of speaking, you really do have to believe in the Trinity because you must believe He is God (well, you could ignore the Holy Spirit, but He wouldn't be mighty happy about it).

It's a gift that nobody deserves.
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He occasionally stumbled over the truth, but hastily picked himself up and hurried on as if nothing had happened.
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Repent and Repentance

#5

Post by Christian2 » Sun May 08, 2005 12:40 pm

I always thought that is was not good enough to repent of your sins, which is merely being sorry and asking God for forgiveness.

I believe that true repentance--what we are asked to do in the Bible-- involves a bit more than asking for forgivenss. Repent means not only to confess and be sorry for your sins but also, and more importantly, to turn around. Repentance means to change directions, have a new way of thinking and living, lead a new life. True repentance brings a changed attitude, a new direction, and a new relationship.

Receiving forgiveness and a new direction, we then extend forgiveness to others daily and forever. So repentance speaks of new beginnings and of continually fresh commitments to the ways of God.

True repentance leads to salvation.

What do you guys think?

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#6

Post by The edge » Sun May 08, 2005 8:08 pm

My fault.
I've not been clear in my question.

Yes,
I do agree with all that's written as far as what's true salvation is. I do regard that a person may think he is saved in the time of saying the sinner's prayer, but is not actually saved if in latter times, he learnt more about virgin birth, diety of Christ, yet do not accept them & his life do not show sign of tansformation.

Now my real Q.
In the NT, believers were added to the church daily thru baptism. There is no indication that the Apostle require any pple professing to accept Christ to go through a Baptismal class to aid them in understanding the finer points of faith, of the church stand nor is there any indication of the requirement for a probabtion period where a the new believer life testimony is being observed, before baptism is administered.

Given that it's likely that people of that era probably understand more about what Christianity stand for as compared to new believers today. Yet, I feel that no amount of counselling & lesson would ever be considered sufficient before a Pastor know for sure if a person is saved before administering baptism.
As a result, what level of checking would you recommend a Pastor do, to be considered sufficient before accepting a candidate for Baptism?

In truth, I've always felt that Baptism should be immediated upon professing Christ as Savior & recognising one is a sinner. Common practises by most churches today stem from the result that some people walk away from the faith after baptism. But this happen to even the most well verse & "holy" Christian.

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#7

Post by AttentionKMartShoppers » Mon May 09, 2005 1:10 pm

Those who were baptisizing, it is possible, had one of the gifts of the Holy Spirit, the discerning of spirits.
"My actions prove that God takes care of idiots."

He occasionally stumbled over the truth, but hastily picked himself up and hurried on as if nothing had happened.
- On Stanley Baldwin

-Winston Churchill

An atheist can't find God for the same reason a criminal can't find a police officer.

You need to start asking out girls so that you can get used to the rejections.
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#8

Post by The edge » Mon May 09, 2005 6:06 pm

AttentionKMartShoppers wrote:Those who were baptisizing, it is possible, had one of the gifts of the Holy Spirit, the discerning of spirits.
I think you're talking about the ideal. In reality, how many have that to the dot? Beside, I also believe that the discerning power is much base on the candidate daily testimony as well as his statement of faith.
The former can be easily faked, while the latter would probably require a long counselling session or a series of classroom lesson. I'm not too infavour of the latter as it seems that we're delaying obedience.

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#9

Post by j316 » Tue May 10, 2005 8:03 am

The edge wrote:My fault.
I've not been clear in my question.

Yes,
I do agree with all that's written as far as what's true salvation is. I do regard that a person may think he is saved in the time of saying the sinner's prayer, but is not actually saved if in latter times, he learnt more about virgin birth, diety of Christ, yet do not accept them & his life do not show sign of tansformation.

Now my real Q.
In the NT, believers were added to the church daily thru baptism. There is no indication that the Apostle require any pple professing to accept Christ to go through a Baptismal class to aid them in understanding the finer points of faith, of the church stand nor is there any indication of the requirement for a probabtion period where a the new believer life testimony is being observed, before baptism is administered.

Given that it's likely that people of that era probably understand more about what Christianity stand for as compared to new believers today. Yet, I feel that no amount of counselling & lesson would ever be considered sufficient before a Pastor know for sure if a person is saved before administering baptism.
As a result, what level of checking would you recommend a Pastor do, to be considered sufficient before accepting a candidate for Baptism?

In truth, I've always felt that Baptism should be immediated upon professing Christ as Savior & recognising one is a sinner. Common practises by most churches today stem from the result that some people walk away from the faith after baptism. But this happen to even the most well verse & "holy" Christian.
I think you are seeing the difference between a church in the process of foundation as opposed to our present status. If the immediacy of Jesus's words in Matthew are interpreted as actually coming in the near future then there would be a sense of urgency that we really don't experience. There was little time and a whole nation to save.

We have more time now so the pace is more leisurely, depending of course on your interpretation of the timeline. But I think if you reflect on the nature of that time you will see why the differences exist.

On your original question of salvation, that occurrs at the instant of acceptance of Jesus as Lord. Repentance is basically a structural requisite because true acceptance is repentance. Most of what was said about repentance is really more in the nature of the understanding of our nature that we get from the Spirit. It is only after a few years of experience that you really begin to understand just how bad we are.

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#10

Post by AttentionKMartShoppers » Tue May 10, 2005 8:07 am

It was only a suggestion.
"My actions prove that God takes care of idiots."

He occasionally stumbled over the truth, but hastily picked himself up and hurried on as if nothing had happened.
- On Stanley Baldwin

-Winston Churchill

An atheist can't find God for the same reason a criminal can't find a police officer.

You need to start asking out girls so that you can get used to the rejections.
-Anonymous

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