Does anyone deserve eternal hell?

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IceMobster
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Does anyone deserve eternal hell?

#1

Post by IceMobster » Wed Jan 13, 2016 2:33 pm

No matter if it is a Mao Zedong or someone who sinned less, does anyone truly deserve eternal hell?
Eternal. Forever.
Pain and suffering forever only because of your actions in a span of 100 years? What are 100 years compared to eternity? Absolutely nothing.

Which raises a question. How can an absolute Love (an adjective we give to God) even think of something as such?
You may claim that God is both absolute love and absolute justice at the same time (which I could agree upon since God is perfect and absolute), but, which one of those absolutes decides who goes where?
And even if He decides that a certain person goes to hell, how could He send someone to hell for an eternity? Where is the love in that?
Even though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I fear no evil, for You are with me.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGOXMf6yDCU

Fecisti nos ad te, Domine, et inquietum est cor nostrum donec requiescat in te!

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Re: Does anyone deserve eternal hell?

#2

Post by Storyteller » Wed Jan 13, 2016 3:20 pm

God doesn't choose who goes to hell.

We ourselves choose, by rejecting Christ.

And we are not punished for our actions, we may be disciplined but not punished. Why should you go to Heaven and spend etrnity with an entity you have never believed in?

Welcome to the forum btw :)
Faith is a knowledge within the heart, beyond the reach of proof - Kahlil Gibran

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Re: Does anyone deserve eternal hell?

#3

Post by Nessa » Wed Jan 13, 2016 3:31 pm

IceMobster wrote:No matter if it is a Mao Zedong or someone who sinned less, does anyone truly deserve eternal hell?
Eternal. Forever.
Pain and suffering forever only because of your actions in a span of 100 years? What are 100 years compared to eternity? Absolutely nothing.

Which raises a question. How can an absolute Love (an adjective we give to God) even think of something as such?
You may claim that God is both absolute love and absolute justice at the same time (which I could agree upon since God is perfect and absolute), but, which one of those absolutes decides who goes where?
And even if He decides that a certain person goes to hell, how could He send someone to hell for an eternity? Where is the love in that?
*flips coin*
Does anyone deserve eternal heaven? y:-?
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Storyteller (Wed Jan 13, 2016 3:34 pm)

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Re: Does anyone deserve eternal hell?

#4

Post by Storyteller » Wed Jan 13, 2016 3:34 pm

Scrap that like....


LOVE that post.
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RickD (Wed Jan 13, 2016 3:40 pm)
Faith is a knowledge within the heart, beyond the reach of proof - Kahlil Gibran

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Re: Does anyone deserve eternal hell?

#5

Post by RickD » Wed Jan 13, 2016 3:41 pm

Oops! Please disregard that like. I was trying to quote you.
:pound:
John 5:24
24 “Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.

Kenny wrote:
"You don’t need faith, logic, reason, proof, or anything else to be atheist, all you need to do is reject what someone told you."



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Re: Does anyone deserve eternal hell?

#6

Post by Storyteller » Wed Jan 13, 2016 3:45 pm

y[-(

Hey! What does the * and ! do?
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Re: Does anyone deserve eternal hell?

#7

Post by Nessa » Wed Jan 13, 2016 3:50 pm

RickD wrote:Oops! Please disregard that like. I was trying to quote you.
:pound:
Tricky ricky takes the mickey
Actually, do you guys use that term over there? y:-?

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Re: Does anyone deserve eternal hell?

#8

Post by Storyteller » Wed Jan 13, 2016 3:54 pm

Nessa wrote:
RickD wrote:Oops! Please disregard that like. I was trying to quote you.
:pound:
Tricky ricky takes the mickey
Actually, do you guys use that term over there? y:-?
I haven't heard that, mind you I don't know how to pronounce words either. Words like y:-?

Aluminium :lol:
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Re: Does anyone deserve eternal hell?

#9

Post by Nessa » Wed Jan 13, 2016 4:00 pm

I say ba-scetty...
For spaghetti... If I dont think about it...it all just makes us rather odd special ;)

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Re: Does anyone deserve eternal hell?

#10

Post by Storyteller » Wed Jan 13, 2016 5:02 pm

I say sketti :D

and miwlk.
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Re: Does anyone deserve eternal hell?

#11

Post by Storyteller » Wed Jan 13, 2016 5:03 pm

Sorry for derailing the thread IceMobster.
Faith is a knowledge within the heart, beyond the reach of proof - Kahlil Gibran

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Re: Does anyone deserve eternal hell?

#12

Post by IceMobster » Wed Jan 13, 2016 6:39 pm

Storyteller wrote:God doesn't choose who goes to hell.

We ourselves choose, by rejecting Christ.

And we are not punished for our actions, we may be disciplined but not punished. Why should you go to Heaven and spend etrnity with an entity you have never believed in?

Welcome to the forum btw :)
By rejecting Christ? Does that mean that Muslims also go to hell? They see Christ as a messenger of God. However, they do not claim he is God. What about adherents of any other religion in the world?
Are they all doomed just because their religion or belief made more sense to them than Christ?

"We may be disciplined but not punished." What is the difference? You go to hell either way?

To get back to my second sentence here, how can you claim God is full of love and/or mercy if all adherents of other religions (and of all those religions before Christianity) are going to hell simply by rejecting Christ?


As for the question you asked; the "!" mark is used to report a post (as can be seen if you put your cursor on it and hold it there for a few seconds) and the "*" mark is used to set a bookmark/to set as if you didn't read this post yet.

As for the welcome part, you have my thanks.
Nessa wrote: *flips coin*
Does anyone deserve eternal heaven? y:-?
Yes, why not? Heaven and earth were once the same thing until the point of Adam & Eve committing sin. After all, it is a place where you get to meet your maker, where you find out the truth, where irrelevant "earthly" things no longer matter. Right?
The thing is, in hell you do not feel good, which is why I asked if anyone deserves not feeling good forever and ever...
Even though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I fear no evil, for You are with me.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGOXMf6yDCU

Fecisti nos ad te, Domine, et inquietum est cor nostrum donec requiescat in te!

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Re: Does anyone deserve eternal hell?

#13

Post by patrick » Thu Jan 14, 2016 3:33 am

IceMobster wrote:
Nessa wrote: *flips coin*
Does anyone deserve eternal heaven? y:-?
Yes, why not? Heaven and earth were once the same thing until the point of Adam & Eve committing sin. After all, it is a place where you get to meet your maker, where you find out the truth, where irrelevant "earthly" things no longer matter. Right?
The thing is, in hell you do not feel good, which is why I asked if anyone deserves not feeling good forever and ever...
Whether an eternal hell means eternal experience, full of suffering, or an external nonexistence, considered a form of suffering, is debateable. Personally this is why I think being barred from eternal life means an eventual, permanent non-existence. Also, I think the torment leading up to that is self-inflicted, simply from not knowing or being connected with the Good.

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Re: Does anyone deserve eternal hell?

#14

Post by neo-x » Thu Jan 14, 2016 3:49 am

As C. S. Lewis once said, "The doors of hell are locked from the inside."
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Re: Does anyone deserve eternal hell?

#15

Post by B. W. » Thu Jan 14, 2016 3:53 am

IceMobster wrote:No matter if it is a Mao Zedong or someone who sinned less, does anyone truly deserve eternal hell?
Eternal. Forever.
Pain and suffering forever only because of your actions in a span of 100 years? What are 100 years compared to eternity? Absolutely nothing.

Which raises a question. How can an absolute Love (an adjective we give to God) even think of something as such?
You may claim that God is both absolute love and absolute justice at the same time (which I could agree upon since God is perfect and absolute), but, which one of those absolutes decides who goes where?

And even if He decides that a certain person goes to hell, how could He send someone to hell for an eternity? Where is the love in that?
How can absolute love really be love if it continues to let itself be played and taken advantage of? Especially by folks who proved doing this continually...

Are you perfect and without flaws, Ice? Have you ever betray, rejected, abandoned, lied about anyone? Ever put folks on trial in your mind? Ever used someone to get your way or blame someone else for your own mistakes? Have you ever manipulated, plotted and schemed? Beaten people with words or fist? Ever stolen anything? Do you think that maybe you are doing so right now, with God, no less?

Fact is Ice, we all deserve hell and be rejected by God. We as human beings are not really nice people. It is we who reject, ignore, abandon, abuse, cheat, lie, steal, blame and cause all the woe. Even the human concept of love is skewed in such a manner as to manipulated God with the pull the heart string get out jail card, a mickey, as the Aussies Kiwi's would say. God has a right to wipe everyone of us out. In Genesis chapter Six he almost did but for his own name sake and his ability to keep his own promises he did not thru a guy named Noah.

Next...

As for Muslims, no , they do not worship the same God. The god of the Muslims demands submission and promotes the subjection of women as toys, as 3 rd class citizens, and is a religion of conquering, not peace in the western sense. Islam, which means peace only when all are conquered and submitted to Islam worldwide, actually promotes death for not converting to Islam, promotes slavery, humiliation, high extortion taxes on those not converting, till they do. They demand world domination and imposing Sharia Law on all, that is the Islamic peace.

No, not the same God at all but rather Islam was founded upon blending four pagan gods into one god, of the moon from the Mecca, Canaan, Babylonian regions. Who sought to overthrow a god in heaven but failed and came to earth to continue the fight to have the great sky god submit to them. Interesting to note about these four deities blended into allah the moon god all seek to have their messiah come to finish the job, interesting. Ice, the god of Muslims is Not the same God as Christians and Jews at all.

Jesus came and died on a cross to set folks free from all there abuse and sin, not enslave them, or kill you if you do not believe. Jesus treated women with respect as equals, not as play things. Jesus proved the love of God real as well as allowing folks to reject that love and telling them of the consequences for doing so people can freely make up their own minds one way or another - all freely I might add, without coercion. Simple choice.

He did, and because of love, warn what will happen to folks in the afterlife who choose to continue to murder, abuse, abandon, reject, manipulate, lie, steal, hurt others, take advantage of, plot and scheme for advantage, game, reject, put of trial, make others carry a heavy burden, crucify... reject the freedom he offers freely. In other words, God gives such folks a place they so desire, a place without him, surround by the things the love to do. As one sows, they also reap.

That is Love absolute. A Love that will absolutely protect those who freely come to be changed freely by Him, free from those that continue to murder, abuse, abandon, reject, manipulate, lie, steal, hurt others, take advantage of, plot and scheme for advantage, game, reject, put of trial, make others carry a heavy burden, crucify, game God by pitting his own character traits against each other in order to escape a jam.

I am wondering if that is what you are doing, Ice, pitting Gods character trait of Love against its own nature in order to get away with all dysfunction by your form of logic and reason?

If a person rejects God's love proved upon that cross of Jesus in this mortal life, then in heaven, they would continue to reject and exploit it. What's to stop them from not doing so as eternal beings? What is there to stop them for exploiting God's character to get their demands? There would no consequences for doing so because in human vernacular, love, cannot say no to dysfunction exploitation as that would be intolerant and mean spirited. You really think, by heavens' osmosis all would change - how could they when on earth they refused?

Isaiah 26:10 explains this because the Heaven is the only truly land of uprightness. Such folks that reject Christ would reject him in heaven and join in Satan's rebellion full swing - always seeking to trip God up by always pitting God's character traits against each other in order for their domination to remain intact. Fact is, Ice, for many folks, they will not behold God's Glory with respect, honor, and love but rather as the means to meet their demands and lust.

So, because of God's great love, he made an everlasting place for those that refuse him (Matt 25:41) that is eternal an everlasting (Matt 25:46) because God being true to his character. God does not take away life because he reneges on no gift. Though are mortal flesh dies, we do not. What we do here on earth to each other, and God, proves what we would continue to do in heaven without end, unless changed before we get there by God's own hand indwelling by a new birth (John 3:16, 36) from him to help begin the needed change.

Love that cannot say NO but always says YES simply enables a person to never face a needed change of direction for mind, heart, and ways is not really love at all y:-?
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