A Bible Reading/Study

[Gabrielman]

Hi Nathaniel!! Ok. The next three "books" are very very short, and I was wondering if I should keep going directly and include Revelation. I think I will. The beginning of Revelation is very good to meditate on, and the rest is highly interesting, with Angels and destruction and all , even if none of us know what all of it means for certain. A lot of people don't read Revelation, from what I can tell, so it would be good to post it I think. Any lengthy discussions or hair-raising debates can be directed to another thread.

Care for some?

Hi Vicki!! Hmm I am not sure, lol about Revelation. It would be good to read it through, I just don't want any debates to erupt on this thread. You did say that debates could be moved to another thread, so I hope people listen to that!!! You heard her people!!!! If you want to debate about Revelation, do it elsewhere!!!!!

I would love some!!!!

2 John (NIV; Bible Gateway)

1The elder,
To the chosen lady and her children, whom I love in the truth—and not I only, but also all who know the truth - 2because of the truth, which lives in us and will be with us forever:

3Grace, mercy and peace from God the Father and from Jesus Christ, the Father's Son, will be with us in truth and love.

4It has given me great joy to find some of your children walking in the truth, just as the Father commanded us. 5And now, dear lady, I am not writing you a new command but one we have had from the beginning. I ask that we love one another. 6And this is love: that we walk in obedience to his commands. As you have heard from the beginning, his command is that you walk in love.

7Many deceivers, who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh, have gone out into the world. Any such person is the deceiver and the antichrist. 8Watch out that you do not lose what you have worked for, but that you may be rewarded fully. 9Anyone who runs ahead and does not continue in the teaching of Christ does not have God; whoever continues in the teaching has both the Father and the Son. 10If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not take him into your house or welcome him. 11Anyone who welcomes him shares in his wicked work.

12I have much to write to you, but I do not want to use paper and ink. Instead, I hope to visit you and talk with you face to face, so that our joy may be complete.

13The children of your chosen sister send their greetings.

Thanks again for posting this!!! Who is he writing too though? Who is this lady? Hmmm... now I really want to know, lol I was reading this at work earlier and I just couldn't figure it out!!! So maybe you can tell me!!!! Other than that I understand most of it. Except where he is saying not to welcome them, aren't we supposed to welcome all to us? Wouldn't that give them a chance to witness to the false teachers and hopefully set them on the right path to God? On this I am confused a bit. I thought Jesus wanted us to show all people love and hospitality and wish them well.
Thank you for all your hard work!!!!

[cslewislover]

Hi! Well I'm in a hurry and so I think I'll edit this later, but it was probably to a person, a person who may have had a church at her house. I have a number of references on it, so I'll be more specific later. Yes, we are to be kind and hospitable! In that day, what John is referring to, is having people stay over night and maybe for a length of time, since the "motels" of the day were not very Christian places! So Christians housed other Christians as the traveled. He is trying to protect them against false teachings - notice that only "some" are following the way of Christ, so most there could be unduly influenced the wrong way. It is better to protect the flock than to be overly kind to someone who is out to draw people away. In his next letter, John actually addresses this more the other way . . .

[Zebulon]

Thanks again for posting this!!! Who is he writing too though? Who is this lady? Hmmm... now I really want to know, lol I was reading this at work earlier and I just couldn't figure it out!!! So maybe you can tell me!!!! Other than that I understand most of it. Except where he is saying not to welcome them, aren't we supposed to welcome all to us? Wouldn't that give them a chance to witness to the false teachers and hopefully set them on the right path to God? On this I am confused a bit. I thought Jesus wanted us to show all people love and hospitality and wish them well.
Thank you for all your hard work!!!!

The Elder to the choice Kyria, and to her children, whom I love in truth, and not I only, but also all those having known the truth, (YLT)

The woman Dame with a capital D in my french bible is Kyria, symbolizin the community of the chosen or the elected. Unfortunately i think B.W. is in a better position to explain it than me.

This is an invitation, B.W.

Zebulon

[cslewislover]

Hi! Well I'm in a hurry and so I think I'll edit this later, but it was probably to a person, a person who may have had a church at her house. I have a number of references on it, so I'll be more specific later. Yes, we are to be kind and hospitable! In that day, what John is referring to, is having people stay over night and maybe for a length of time, since the "motels" of the day were not very Christian places! So Christians housed other Christians as the traveled. He is trying to protect them against false teachings - notice that only "some" are following the way of Christ, so most there could be unduly influenced the wrong way. It is better to protect the flock than to be overly kind to someone who is out to draw people away. In his next letter, John actually addresses this more the other way . . .

Hi again Nathaniel. My bibles and commentaries have things on this, but they're all sort-of the same, I believe. Right now I'm looking in my Sheperd's Notes. The letter could've been to a person, but it doesn't make that much sense that way, and is more likely written to a small congregation--and they met in houses, of course. We can't see it in our translations (I don't know why they translate like this), but "you" in this letter switches from singular to plural often (why not just write "you all" or "all of you" when it is plural???). In the next letter, which is to a person, the "you" is always singular. The rest of what I said is what is meant in the letter, in a nutshell. I could talk about that more, but maybe it would be better to do that after we look at 3 John, since it is very much related.

Oh, and I've thought about what to move along with more. 3 John (below) and Jude, yes. But maybe I should go to like the Gospel of John and continue in the NT till we get back to where we started here. The beginning of Revelation is good though, with the letters to the churches and what they say to us today. Should I do that part of Revelation and skip the rest for now?


3 John (NIV)

1The elder,
To my dear friend Gaius, whom I love in the truth.

2Dear friend, I pray that you may enjoy good health and that all may go well with you, even as your soul is getting along well. 3It gave me great joy to have some brothers come and tell about your faithfulness to the truth and how you continue to walk in the truth. 4I have no greater joy than to hear that my children are walking in the truth.

5Dear friend, you are faithful in what you are doing for the brothers, even though they are strangers to you. 6They have told the church about your love. You will do well to send them on their way in a manner worthy of God. 7It was for the sake of the Name that they went out, receiving no help from the pagans. 8We ought therefore to show hospitality to such men so that we may work together for the truth.

9I wrote to the church, but Diotrephes, who loves to be first, will have nothing to do with us. 10So if I come, I will call attention to what he is doing, gossiping maliciously about us. Not satisfied with that, he refuses to welcome the brothers. He also stops those who want to do so and puts them out of the church.

11Dear friend, do not imitate what is evil but what is good. Anyone who does what is good is from God. Anyone who does what is evil has not seen God. 12Demetrius is well spoken of by everyone—and even by the truth itself. We also speak well of him, and you know that our testimony is true.

13I have much to write you, but I do not want to do so with pen and ink. 14I hope to see you soon, and we will talk face to face.
Peace to you. The friends here send their greetings. Greet the friends there by name.

[Gabrielman]

Hi again Nathaniel. My bibles and commentaries have things on this, but they're all sort-of the same, I believe. Right now I'm looking in my Sheperd's Notes. The letter could've been to a person, but it doesn't make that much sense that way, and is more likely written to a small congregation--and they met in houses, of course. We can't see it in our translations (I don't know why they translate like this), but "you" in this letter switches from singular to plural often (why not just write "you all" or "all of you" when it is plural???). In the next letter, which is to a person, the "you" is always singular. The rest of what I said is what is meant in the letter, in a nutshell. I could talk about that more, but maybe it would be better to do that after we look at 3 John, since it is very much related.

Oh, and I've thought about what to move along with more. 3 John (below) and Jude, yes. But maybe I should go to like the Gospel of John and continue in the NT till we get back to where we started here. The beginning of Revelation is good though, with the letters to the churches and what they say to us today. Should I do that part of Revelation and skip the rest for now?

Hi Vicki! Thanks for the help with that, but that is odd about how it may have been addressed to an entire congregation!!! It would be good to know more about this and now I will read the next one to see if that helps, lol!!! Thanks for all this hard work you are doing!!!! It helps me with reading the Word!!!!!!

[cslewislover]

Ok. Well, for something real short here is part of what is in Halley's Bible Handbook regarding 2 John.

The Chosen Lady (v. 1). She may have been an individual, a well-known and prominent woman, somewhere near Ephesus, in whose home a church met. Or John may be referring to a local church, symbolically called a lady (just as the church as a whole is called "the Bride of Christ"). Her "chosen sister" (v. 13) is then either another prominent Christian woman leader in the congregation in which John was resident, or the congregation itself. . . . False Teachers (vv. 7-11). These are teachers John already referred to in 1 John 2:18-29: they go from church to church, teaching in the name of Christ doctrines that are utterly subversive of the Christian faith. This letter seems to have been written to caution the "chosen lady" to be on her guard and to refuse hospitality to such teachers. Note that the warning is prefaced by an exhortation to love (vv. 5-6), as if to indicate that the practice of Christian love does not mean that we should give encouragement to enemies of the truth (pp 889-890).

I could copy what is in my Shepherd's notes as well, since it's a bit different, as I wrote about before. And I could look in some of my other sources as well.

[cslewislover]

Ok, I'll put in here some of the historical perspective things from my Shepherd's Notes (Broadman&Holman Reference), I think you'll like them, and they are good for anyone to know.

Thanks to the expansion and economic developments of the Roman Empire during the first century, travel had become much easier than ever before. The Romans had established a fine network of roads that connected most of the empire. The Pax Romana (peace of Rome) made traveling safer, and teh spread of Greek and Latin as universal languages made it more inviting. All of these changes helped the spread of Christianity during the first century (p 85).

As both Christian people and itinerant Christian teachers traveled, they would need a place to stay. Inns and hotels as we know them today were nonexistent in the first century. The ancient inns were not as comfortable as a private home. They usually housed as many fleas and as much dust as they did guests. They were also generally known for their dishonorable atmosphere, which was prompted by the poor character of most innkeepers. So it became a common practice for local Christians to open their homes to traveling Christians. Such hospitality is seen throughout the New Testament (Acts 16:15; 17:7; 21:8, 16; Rom 16:23). This genuine hospitality was also abused by people who were simply looking for free lodging (p 86).

The Christians were not the only traveling teachers in the first-century world. Many devoted followers of various religions hit the roads to extol their beliefs and win a material profit at the same time. Such schemes were not always easily detectable. The question of whom to host was a practical concern for these believers (90).

[cslewislover]

Jude 1 (NIV, Bible Gateway)

1Jude, a servant of Jesus Christ and a brother of James,
To those who have been called, who are loved by God the Father and kept by[a] Jesus Christ:

2Mercy, peace and love be yours in abundance.

[The sin and doom of Godless men]
3Dear friends, although I was very eager to write to you about the salvation we share, I felt I had to write and urge you to contend for the faith that was once for all entrusted to the saints. 4For certain men whose condemnation was written about long ago have secretly slipped in among you. They are godless men, who change the grace of our God into a license for immorality and deny Jesus Christ our only Sovereign and Lord.

5Though you already know all this, I want to remind you that the Lord[c] delivered his people out of Egypt, but later destroyed those who did not believe. 6And the angels who did not keep their positions of authority but abandoned their own home—these he has kept in darkness, bound with everlasting chains for judgment on the great Day. 7In a similar way, Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding towns gave themselves up to sexual immorality and perversion. They serve as an example of those who suffer the punishment of eternal fire.

8In the very same way, these dreamers pollute their own bodies, reject authority and slander celestial beings. 9But even the archangel Michael, when he was disputing with the devil about the body of Moses, did not dare to bring a slanderous accusation against him, but said, "The Lord rebuke you!" 10Yet these men speak abusively against whatever they do not understand; and what things they do understand by instinct, like unreasoning animals—these are the very things that destroy them.

11Woe to them! They have taken the way of Cain; they have rushed for profit into Balaam's error; they have been destroyed in Korah's rebellion.

12These men are blemishes at your love feasts, eating with you without the slightest qualm—shepherds who feed only themselves. They are clouds without rain, blown along by the wind; autumn trees, without fruit and uprooted—twice dead. 13They are wild waves of the sea, foaming up their shame; wandering stars, for whom blackest darkness has been reserved forever.

14Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied about these men: "See, the Lord is coming with thousands upon thousands of his holy ones 15to judge everyone, and to convict all the ungodly of all the ungodly acts they have done in the ungodly way, and of all the harsh words ungodly sinners have spoken against him." 16These men are grumblers and faultfinders; they follow their own evil desires; they boast about themselves and flatter others for their own advantage.

[A call to persevere]
17But, dear friends, remember what the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ foretold. 18They said to you, "In the last times there will be scoffers who will follow their own ungodly desires." 19These are the men who divide you, who follow mere natural instincts and do not have the Spirit.

20But you, dear friends, build yourselves up in your most holy faith and pray in the Holy Spirit. 21Keep yourselves in God's love as you wait for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ to bring you to eternal life.

22Be merciful to those who doubt; 23snatch others from the fire and save them; to others show mercy, mixed with fear—hating even the clothing stained by corrupted flesh.
Doxology
24To him who is able to keep you from falling and to present you before his glorious presence without fault and with great joy— 25to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.

Footnotes:

a. Jude 1:1 Or for; or in
b. Jude 1:4 Or men who were marked out for condemnation
c. Jude 1:5 Some early manuscripts Jesus

[cslewislover]

The following info is from the Archaeological Study Bible (Zondervan 2005), p 2041.

Pseudepigrapha, meaning “false title,” refers to Jewish books that falsely claimed to have been written by Moses, Enoch, Abraham or some other ancient hero of the faith. Most pseudepigrapha were written between 250 B.C. and A.D. 200.

As a rule the New Testament authors avoided this material, but Jude appears to have made use of it in two places. In verse 9 he alluded to a story concerning Michael and the devil that is found in a version of The Assumption of Moses (as noted by Clement and Origen; the actual text is lost). Also, in verse 14 Jude quoted from 1 Enoch 1:9: “See, the Lord is coming with thousands upon thousands of his holy ones.” It is possible that through God's providence some pseudepigrapha have preserved some genuine traditions and that Jude was able to discern the true from the false. Given the nature of these books, however, it would be perilous to treat them as reliable sources. It is also helpful to keep in mind that citation of a given work by a Biblical author does not in and of itself imply endorsement. Paul cited pagan poets (Ac 17:28; 1 Co 15:33; Tit 1:12), and Jude's references to 1 Enoch do not imply that he thought the book had canonical authority.

[Gabrielman]

Thanks for posting Vicki!!!! I assume that a bit of that is about the end times, no questions really! But I can't wait to read the next chapter!!!!!!!

[cslewislover]

Thanks for posting Vicki!!!! I assume that a bit of that is about the end times, no questions really! But I can't wait to read the next chapter!!!!!!!

Hi Nathaniel! +

Jude doesn't have any more chapters, and I should've taken that "1" off, but that's the way it was from Bible Gateway. I'll go ahead and include the beginning of Revelation, the letters to the churches, then I'll go to the Gospel of John. Unless something changes . . . Enjoy!


Revelation 1 (New International Version)

[Prologue]
1The revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show his servants what must soon take place. He made it known by sending his angel to his servant John, 2who testifies to everything he saw—that is, the word of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ. 3Blessed is the one who reads the words of this prophecy, and blessed are those who hear it and take to heart what is written in it, because the time is near.

[Greetings and doxology]
4John,
To the seven churches in the province of Asia:

Grace and peace to you from him who is, and who was, and who is to come, and from the seven spirits[a] before his throne, 5and from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth.

To him who loves us and has freed us from our sins by his blood, 6and has made us to be a kingdom and priests to serve his God and Father—to him be glory and power for ever and ever! Amen.
7Look, he is coming with the clouds,
and every eye will see him,
even those who pierced him;
and all the peoples of the earth will mourn because of him. So shall it be! Amen.

8"I am the Alpha and the Omega," says the Lord God, "who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty."

[One like a Son of Man]
9I, John, your brother and companion in the suffering and kingdom and patient endurance that are ours in Jesus, was on the island of Patmos because of the word of God and the testimony of Jesus. 10 On the Lord's Day I was in the Spirit, and I heard behind me a loud voice like a trumpet, 11which said: "Write on a scroll what you see and send it to the seven churches: to Ephesus, Smyrna, Pergamum, Thyatira, Sardis, Philadelphia and Laodicea."

12I turned around to see the voice that was speaking to me. And when I turned I saw seven golden lampstands, 13and among the lampstands was someone "like a son of man,"dressed in a robe reaching down to his feet and with a golden sash around his chest. 14His head and hair were white like wool, as white as snow, and his eyes were like blazing fire. 15His feet were like bronze glowing in a furnace, and his voice was like the sound of rushing waters. 16In his right hand he held seven stars, and out of his mouth came a sharp double-edged sword. His face was like the sun shining in all its brilliance.

17When I saw him, I fell at his feet as though dead. Then he placed his right hand on me and said: "Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last. 18I am the Living One; I was dead, and behold I am alive for ever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades.

19"Write, therefore, what you have seen, what is now and what will take place later. 20The mystery of the seven stars that you saw in my right hand and of the seven golden lampstands is this: The seven stars are the angels[c] of the seven churches, and the seven lampstands are the seven churches.

Footnotes:

a. Revelation 1:5 Or the sevenfold Spirit
b. Revelation 1:13 Daniel 7:13
c. Revelation 1:20 Or messengers

[cslewislover]

Revelation 2 (NIV, Bible Gateway)

To the church in Ephesus

1"To the angel[a] of the church in Ephesus write:
These are the words of him who holds the seven stars in his right hand and walks among the seven golden lampstands: 2I know your deeds, your hard work and your perseverance. I know that you cannot tolerate wicked men, that you have tested those who claim to be apostles but are not, and have found them false. 3You have persevered and have endured hardships for my name, and have not grown weary. 4Yet I hold this against you: You have forsaken your first love. 5Remember the height from which you have fallen! Repent and do the things you did at first. If you do not repent, I will come to you and remove your lampstand from its place. 6But you have this in your favor: You hate the practices of the Nicolaitans, which I also hate. 7He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To him who overcomes, I will give the right to eat from the tree of life, which is in the paradise of God.

To the Church in Smyrna

8"To the angel of the church in Smyrna write:
These are the words of him who is the First and the Last, who died and came to life again. 9I know your afflictions and your poverty—yet you are rich! I know the slander of those who say they are Jews and are not, but are a synagogue of Satan. 10Do not be afraid of what you are about to suffer. I tell you, the devil will put some of you in prison to test you, and you will suffer persecution for ten days. Be faithful, even to the point of death, and I will give you the crown of life. 11He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. He who overcomes will not be hurt at all by the second death.

To the Church in Pergamum

12"To the angel of the church in Pergamum write:
These are the words of him who has the sharp, double-edged sword. 13I know where you live—where Satan has his throne. Yet you remain true to my name. You did not renounce your faith in me, even in the days of Antipas, my faithful witness, who was put to death in your city—where Satan lives. 14Nevertheless, I have a few things against you: You have people there who hold to the teaching of Balaam, who taught Balak to entice the Israelites to sin by eating food sacrificed to idols and by committing sexual immorality. 15Likewise you also have those who hold to the teaching of the Nicolaitans. 16Repent therefore! Otherwise, I will soon come to you and will fight against them with the sword of my mouth. 17He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To him who overcomes, I will give some of the hidden manna. I will also give him a white stone with a new name written on it, known only to him who receives it.

To the Church in Thyatira

18"To the angel of the church in Thyatira write:
These are the words of the Son of God, whose eyes are like blazing fire and whose feet are like burnished bronze. 19I know your deeds, your love and faith, your service and perseverance, and that you are now doing more than you did at first. 20Nevertheless, I have this against you: You tolerate that woman Jezebel, who calls herself a prophetess. By her teaching she misleads my servants into sexual immorality and the eating of food sacrificed to idols. 21I have given her time to repent of her immorality, but she is unwilling. 22So I will cast her on a bed of suffering, and I will make those who commit adultery with her suffer intensely, unless they repent of her ways. 23I will strike her children dead. Then all the churches will know that I am he who searches hearts and minds, and I will repay each of you according to your deeds. 24Now I say to the rest of you in Thyatira, to you who do not hold to her teaching and have not learned Satan's so-called deep secrets (I will not impose any other burden on you): 25Only hold on to what you have until I come. 26To him who overcomes and does my will to the end, I will give authority over the nations—
27'He will rule them with an iron scepter;
he will dash them to pieces like pottery'— just as I have received authority from my Father. 28I will also give him the morning star. 29He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.

Footnotes:

a. Revelation 2:1 Or messenger; also in verses 8, 12 and 18
b. Revelation 2:27 Psalm 2:9

[cslewislover]

Revelation 3 (NIV, Bible Gateway)

[To the Church in Sardis]
1"To the angel[a] of the church in Sardis write:
These are the words of him who holds the seven spiritsof God and the seven stars. I know your deeds; you have a reputation of being alive, but you are dead. 2Wake up! Strengthen what remains and is about to die, for I have not found your deeds complete in the sight of my God. 3Remember, therefore, what you have received and heard; obey it, and repent. But if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what time I will come to you. 4Yet you have a few people in Sardis who have not soiled their clothes. They will walk with me, dressed in white, for they are worthy. 5He who overcomes will, like them, be dressed in white. I will never blot out his name from the book of life, but will acknowledge his name before my Father and his angels. 6He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.

[To the Church in Philadelphia]
7"To the angel of the church in Philadelphia write:
These are the words of him who is holy and true, who holds the key of David. What he opens no one can shut, and what he shuts no one can open. 8I know your deeds. See, I have placed before you an open door that no one can shut. I know that you have little strength, yet you have kept my word and have not denied my name. 9I will make those who are of the synagogue of Satan, who claim to be Jews though they are not, but are liars—I will make them come and fall down at your feet and acknowledge that I have loved you. 10Since you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come upon the whole world to test those who live on the earth. 11I am coming soon. Hold on to what you have, so that no one will take your crown. 12Him who overcomes I will make a pillar in the temple of my God. Never again will he leave it. I will write on him the name of my God and the name of the city of my God, the new Jerusalem, which is coming down out of heaven from my God; and I will also write on him my new name. 13He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.

[To the Church in Laodicea]
14"To the angel of the church in Laodicea write:
These are the words of the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the ruler of God's creation. 15I know your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot. I wish you were either one or the other! 16So, because you are lukewarm—neither hot nor cold—I am about to spit you out of my mouth. 17You say, 'I am rich; I have acquired wealth and do not need a thing.' But you do not realize that you are wretched, pitiful, poor, blind and naked. 18I counsel you to buy from me gold refined in the fire, so you can become rich; and white clothes to wear, so you can cover your shameful nakedness; and salve to put on your eyes, so you can see. 19Those whom I love I rebuke and discipline. So be earnest, and repent. 20Here I am! I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in and eat with him, and he with me. 21To him who overcomes, I will give the right to sit with me on my throne, just as I overcame and sat down with my Father on his throne. 22He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches."

Footnotes:

a. Revelation 3:1 Or messenger; also in verses 7 and 14
b. Revelation 3:1 Or the sevenfold Spirit

[Gabrielman]

Hm Revelation is a strange book indeed, lol but the only question I had you already answered!!!! LOL! You know that I was reading some where that people were arguing that Revelation applied to only the time of John but I just don't see that, I mean the arguments they made were so weak too!!!!
Thank you again for posting this my dear! Keep up the wonderful work!!!!!!
=

[Gabrielman]

I was wondering if you were going to post all of Revelation or if you were only going to do the first part and then post another book. I would love to do a study on Proverbs!!!!! That would be most fun!!!!!! Keep up the great work!!!!