It might not hurt to go back to the Gospels and take a closer look Dave.CallMeDave wrote:Its interesting to note, that, Jesus rubbed shoulders with scandalous Tax Collectors and Prositutes...but he never condoned their behavior which was sin. Jesus is a Friend of Sinners and our Churches are supposed to be a Hospital for SInners...because people arent supposed to remain in their sin filled Lifestyles . Instead, they are supposed to find Christ and exit the lifestyles which have them on the fast track to a Godless eternity. Christ came to seek and to save those which were lost ... lost in their poorly chosen lifestyles of sin so they could live a victorious life IN CHRIST and be delivered out of the World and its philosophies (Colossians 2:8) . CHrist came so we would have pleasing life to God...and not a sexually bondaged life which God considers perversion , abomination, and harmful to ourselves. Further, Gods Word calls us to expose such evil worldly philosophies that go against the teachings of Christ , therefore it is proper to do so .Canuckster1127 wrote:It's probably a good thing that there were no "real christians" present when Jesus told those watching his interaction with the woman taken in adultery (apparently in the very act and part of her lifestyle) to examine themselves and let those with no sin caste the first stone. I get the feeling there might be some on this thread who would have been warming up in the bullpen and ready to go before the last syllable left His lips.
First, I don't see anyone in this thread defending sin or arguing license so you're arguing against a straw man of your own divising when you attempt to establish yourself as opposed to that when nobody here fits the bill of what you're arguing against.
Second, Jesus chose the company of tax collectors and prostitutes over the company of self-righteous religious people and further those sinners were attracted to Him because while He didn't condone their sin, He demonstrated love and acceptance for them in contrast to the self-righteous religious people who were the most established in the scriptures and who were outwardly the most righteous and least sinful people in the community. Those Pharisees today would be (and often are) the most upstanding members of churches today and their "proud" tradition continues.
Jesus received those sinners before they were made into what you describe and further, unless you're advocating that you believe even a believer or you yourself can be without sin and able to have the mind of God to determine who is saved and who is not then perhaps you need to see if your view of sinners is more in line with Christ or more in line with those whom Christ criticized the most unrelentingly and publically for their self-righteious attitude.
It's one thing to speak of other Brothers and Sisters in Christ who are caught in sin and to challenge and encourage them to return and experience fully all that Christ has for them, including the strength to grow and resist temptation. It's another thing to place yourself on the Judgment throne of God and proclaim who is a "real" and isn't a "real" Christian. That is not spiritual maturity. That is immature spiritual arrogance. The judgment as to anyone's salvation is up to God, not you and not anyone else.I Cor 3: 1 Brothers and sisters, I could not address you as people who live by the Spirit but as people who are still worldly—mere infants in Christ. 2 I gave you milk, not solid food, for you were not yet ready for it. Indeed, you are still not ready. 3 You are still worldly. For since there is jealousy and quarreling among you, are you not worldly? Are you not acting like mere humans? 4 For when one says, “I follow Paul,” and another, “I follow Apollos,” are you not mere human beings?
5 What, after all, is Apollos? And what is Paul? Only servants, through whom you came to believe—as the Lord has assigned to each his task. 6 I planted the seed, Apollos watered it, but God has been making it grow. 7 So neither the one who plants nor the one who waters is anything, but only God, who makes things grow. 8 The one who plants and the one who waters have one purpose, and they will each be rewarded according to their own labor. 9 For we are co-workers in God’s service; you are God’s field, God’s building.
10 By the grace God has given me, I laid a foundation as a wise builder, and someone else is building on it. But each one should build with care. 11 For no one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 If anyone builds on this foundation using gold, silver, costly stones, wood, hay or straw, 13 their work will be shown for what it is, because the Day will bring it to light. It will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test the quality of each person’s work. 14 If what has been built survives, the builder will receive a reward. 15 If it is burned up, the builder will suffer loss but yet will be saved—even though only as one escaping through the flames.