Homosexuality is not a sin

Discussion for Christian perspectives on ethical issues such as abortion, euthanasia, sexuality, and so forth.
bippy123
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Re: Homosexuality is not a sin

#76

Post by bippy123 » Wed Apr 11, 2012 8:47 pm

Danieltwotwenty wrote:
bippy123 wrote:
Byblos wrote:
CallMeDave wrote:We should not read things into scripture to make sinful lifestyles more palatable the same we should not read into the Genesis account of Creation ' millions of years ' to make it more palatable with popular secular stellar evolutionary thought.
Ya just had to go there didn't ya! :poke:
Put your hands in the like you don't care and yommmmm
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Re: Homosexuality is not a sin

#77

Post by CallMeDave » Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:16 am

Byblos wrote:
CallMeDave wrote:We should not read things into scripture to make sinful lifestyles more palatable the same we should not read into the Genesis account of Creation ' millions of years ' to make it more palatable with popular secular stellar evolutionary thought.
Ya just had to go there didn't ya! :poke:
You betcha . Reading things into scripture that arent there, is not nice to do.
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Re: Homosexuality is not a sin

#78

Post by BryanH » Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:52 am

I think that this discussion has proved how interpretation can lead to different opinions, very different opinions.

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Re: Homosexuality is not a sin

#79

Post by Byblos » Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:00 pm

CallMeDave wrote:Reading things into scripture that arent there, is not nice to do.
Oh I fully agree Dave. :esurprised:
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Re: Homosexuality is not a sin

#80

Post by CallMeDave » Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:30 pm

BryanH wrote:I think that this discussion has proved how interpretation can lead to different opinions, very different opinions.

Not on the subject of Sin and why Christ came to earth to conquer its affect on our life . He came to give us power OVER being addicted to sin lifestyles like homosexuality and heterosexual casual sex for instance. So much so that in 1 Cor. 5 we are commanded to stay away from those who say they are Christians yet regularly engage in a lifestyle of sexual sin . Note that it doesnt say 'UNLESS the person is addicted' !
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Re: Homosexuality is not a sin

#81

Post by BryanH » Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:46 pm

Not on the subject of Sin and why Christ came to earth to conquer its affect on our life . He came to give us power OVER being addicted to sin lifestyles like homosexuality and heterosexual casual sex for instance. So much so that in 1 Cor. 5 we are commanded to stay away from those who say they are Christians yet regularly engage in a lifestyle of sexual sin . Note that it doesnt say 'UNLESS the person is addicted' !
Good luck for the future to come!!

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Re: Homosexuality is not a sin

#82

Post by PaulSacramento » Thu Apr 12, 2012 1:04 pm

We must always take into account the genre of the scripture when we try to interpret it and more so when we try to apply it to modern times.
Not all scripture is literal AND concrete or on the same level of inspiration ( compare Numbers with Isaiah for example).
That said, the passages against homosexuality are quite clear ( even if female homosexuality was not mentioned in the OT).
Homosexuality is a sin, it is not right and not viewed as correct by any of the writers of any of the books that mention it.
That said, we must endevour to "love the sinner and hate the sin" and never forget that.
I won't argue whether or not one can be a Christian and homosexual, that is for Christ to judge and decide.
I do believe that IF one accepts the HS into our lives that the sins we have done and are still in us to do, CAN be overcome.

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Re: Homosexuality is not a sin

#83

Post by CallMeDave » Thu Apr 12, 2012 1:19 pm

PaulSacramento wrote: ...............
I won't argue whether or not one can be a Christian and homosexual, that is for Christ to judge and decide.
I do believe that IF one accepts the HS into our lives that the sins we have done and are still in us to do, CAN be overcome.
Paul, The Bible doesnt condemn all critical thinking (judging) and in fact there is plenty of scripture which encourages us to judge, discern, then help a wayward person get back on the right road. As for being a lifestyle homosexual AND a real born again Christian...if a real Christian can be One then Christ failed at coming to Earth giving us the power to be Overcomers of sinful dangerous perverted lifestyles. And the passage in 1 Cor. 5 commanding us to not have anything to do with a professed Christian who is habitually involved in sexual sin , becomes nullified .
"I never asserted such an absurd proposition, that something could arise without a Cause" -- staunch atheist Philosopher David Hume.

"What this world now needs is Christian love or compassion" -- staunch atheist Bertrand Russell.

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Re: Homosexuality is not a sin

#84

Post by CallMeDave » Thu Apr 12, 2012 1:28 pm

BryanH wrote:
Not on the subject of Sin and why Christ came to earth to conquer its affect on our life . He came to give us power OVER being addicted to sin lifestyles like homosexuality and heterosexual casual sex for instance. So much so that in 1 Cor. 5 we are commanded to stay away from those who say they are Christians yet regularly engage in a lifestyle of sexual sin . Note that it doesnt say 'UNLESS the person is addicted' !
Good luck for the future to come!!
Its not 'luck' that a person needs to be an Overcomer of habitual sinful lifestyles...its the available power which comes from Christ crucified -- the power to make us victorious over Satans plan to keep us in bondage and enslavement to sin. If we keep on fooling ourselves that we can get away with being immeshed in the very lifestyle sins which Christ died for, then we have adoped the 'greasy-grace' syndrome . And THAT is not walking in the victory of Christ , nor the kind of life that God wants for us, and essentially is still being friends with the world and its lustful immoral pleasures. We are called to be NEW creations and to make our bodies a living sacrifice to God and in humble appreciation and gratitude for what he has done for us. Let us not treat Gods mercy in a flippant manner because we want to partake in lifestyles that give us temporary superficial fleshly pleasures.
"I never asserted such an absurd proposition, that something could arise without a Cause" -- staunch atheist Philosopher David Hume.

"What this world now needs is Christian love or compassion" -- staunch atheist Bertrand Russell.

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Re: Homosexuality is not a sin

#85

Post by BavarianWheels » Thu Apr 12, 2012 2:07 pm

CallMeDave wrote:
PaulSacramento wrote: ...............
I won't argue whether or not one can be a Christian and homosexual, that is for Christ to judge and decide.
I do believe that IF one accepts the HS into our lives that the sins we have done and are still in us to do, CAN be overcome.
Paul, The Bible doesnt condemn all critical thinking (judging) and in fact there is plenty of scripture which encourages us to judge, discern, then help a wayward person get back on the right road. As for being a lifestyle homosexual AND a real born again Christian...if a real Christian can be One then Christ failed at coming to Earth giving us the power to be Overcomers of sinful dangerous perverted lifestyles. And the passage in 1 Cor. 5 commanding us to not have anything to do with a professed Christian who is habitually involved in sexual sin , becomes nullified .
I've been lurking around for a while now. I didn't really find anything that I felt compelled to comment on, but now this is posted.

Is heterosexuality a lifestyle? I am no proponent of the homosexual lifestyle much like I do not promote the heterosexual lifestyle as they are not ideas, thoughts, or a stance we choose from one moment to the next based on our whims.

Christ did not come so that we could overcome sin, but that EVEN THOUGH WE ARE SINNERS, grace is given to us by Christ through faith. There is nothing we must accomplish to gain this grace as it is a gift. To say one must overcome the "sinful dangerous perverted lifestyle [of homosexuality] is to claim Christ's Righteousness weak.

This is not to say that this gives the homosexual carte blanche to act as he/she pleases, much like it doesn't give the heterosexual carte blanche to act as he/she pleases. We are sinners from birth and no amount of "overcoming" gains the Christian salvation.

A homosexual can, then IMHO, be a Christian. One that struggles with a huge demon that I could not overcome. If the circumstances were turned, I could not at all, not even joking, could I turn my "love" of women as sexual and life partners...I don't wish that struggle on anyone and certainly would NEVER condemn someone in that struggle to say they are lost unless they switch teams. That struggle is personal. Only the person and God know the heart.

Hopefully I worded my thoughts correctly...

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Re: Homosexuality is not a sin

#86

Post by RickD » Thu Apr 12, 2012 4:46 pm

CallMeDave wrote:
Byblos wrote:
CallMeDave wrote:We should not read things into scripture to make sinful lifestyles more palatable the same we should not read into the Genesis account of Creation ' millions of years ' to make it more palatable with popular secular stellar evolutionary thought.
Ya just had to go there didn't ya! :poke:
You betcha . Reading things into scripture that arent there, is not nice to do.
Kinda like reading "no animal death before the fall", into scripture? Or is it only a wrong interpretation when it doesn't agree with your dogmatic view?
John 5:24
24 “Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.

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Re: Homosexuality is not a sin

#87

Post by Canuckster1127 » Thu Apr 12, 2012 4:55 pm

Nice to see you Bav. Have missed seeing you around as much.
Dogmatism is the comfortable intellectual framework of self-righteousness. Self-righteousness is more decadent than the worst sexual sin. ~ Dan Allender

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Re: Homosexuality is not a sin

#88

Post by bippy123 » Thu Apr 12, 2012 10:57 pm

BryanH wrote:I think that this discussion has proved how interpretation can lead to different opinions, very different opinions.
This is why most if the times I don't interpret scripture by myself:) , maybe there was someone that was given the authority to interpret scripture:)

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Re: Homosexuality is not a sin

#89

Post by PaulSacramento » Fri Apr 13, 2012 5:43 am

CallMeDave wrote:
PaulSacramento wrote: ...............
I won't argue whether or not one can be a Christian and homosexual, that is for Christ to judge and decide.
I do believe that IF one accepts the HS into our lives that the sins we have done and are still in us to do, CAN be overcome.
Paul, The Bible doesnt condemn all critical thinking (judging) and in fact there is plenty of scripture which encourages us to judge, discern, then help a wayward person get back on the right road. As for being a lifestyle homosexual AND a real born again Christian...if a real Christian can be One then Christ failed at coming to Earth giving us the power to be Overcomers of sinful dangerous perverted lifestyles. And the passage in 1 Cor. 5 commanding us to not have anything to do with a professed Christian who is habitually involved in sexual sin , becomes nullified .
Critical thinking is not condemned but judge others is ( see 1Peter) and for those that judge, the very measure of how they judge, they too will be judged.
Personally I am not qualified to Judge ANYONE on whether they are or are not Christian ( or what type of Christian they are) and so I leave that to Christ.
I have enough to answer for already.
I agree that homosexuality is a sin and must be dealt with by anyone professing to be of Christ.
It is a struggles for us ALL to deal with sin, sometimes we win the battle but more often we lose, that is why I am thankful for the Grace of God through Christ.
And why I won't judge anyone elses failings since I have enough of a hard time with my own.

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Re: Homosexuality is not a sin

#90

Post by RickD » Fri Apr 13, 2012 6:02 am

CallmeDave wrote:
Paul, The Bible doesnt condemn all critical thinking (judging) and in fact there is plenty of scripture which encourages us to judge, discern, then help a wayward person get back on the right road. As for being a lifestyle homosexual AND a real born again Christian...if a real Christian can be One then Christ failed at coming to Earth giving us the power to be Overcomers of sinful dangerous perverted lifestyles. And the passage in 1 Cor. 5 commanding us to not have anything to do with a professed Christian who is habitually involved in sexual sin , becomes nullified .
Dave, just out of curiosity, in your eyes, is anyone who struggles with sin not a real Christian? Or, is it only those who struggle with homosexuality that can't be "real" Christians?
John 5:24
24 “Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.

Kenny wrote:
"You don’t need faith, logic, reason, proof, or anything else to be atheist, all you need to do is reject what someone told you."



St. Richard the Sarcastic--The Patron Saint of Irony

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