Evidence for God from Science

Thanks for sharing that testimony. Hearing ones like this always strenghten my faith and make me want to draw nearer to God.

I've got another one too. It's not a life-changing testimony, or the testimony of how I came to be a believer, but it's a tesimony to God's love for anyone who needs to hear.

My mom and dad are going through a divorce. My mom called my dad three days ago to ask him if he could pick me up to bring me to church since she couldn't.

Anyway, they got into talking about other things and my mom was trying to be friendly, but then my dad just lost it and started screaming at her about something to do with the divorce. I was in the room, and I could hear him yelling through the phone. Then my mom just hung up and was just in shock because in the 30 years that they've known each other he's never talked to her like that. She told me that he called her stupid and told her she's making too many stupid mistakes and stuff like that.

Anyway, she was pretty shooken up about it. Then about two hours later the phone rang, and she answered it. She said "Hello?" a few times but no respose so she shrugged and hung up, but she seemed to be a little happy about what she saw on the Caller ID. The phone rang again later and she went into her room all happily and started talking to whoever it was who called.

Then she eventually came out and started yelling "This is wierd! This is wierd!" (she's not a Christian), and told me it was her boyfriend, who is usually never able to call on Tuesdays. She said that he said "Something tells me you're having a bad day, so I made time to call."

Vash, I really enjoyed reading your tesitmony about coming to God. In my own life God has a history of giving me the exact book that I need for what I'm dealing with at the time. lol Just gave me two that I'm now joyfully reading, in fact! lol I'm very glad for you.

But your last post disturbs me. I was shocked and dismayed and even a bit angered. I mean, it's very clear that your mother having a boyfriend while not yet divorced is adultery. Gives me cause to greatly sympathize with your father in his anger. How long have they been having a romantic relationship? Did it start before the divorce, or was maybe even part of the cause of it?

But that's not what got me the most. What did get me was your apparent okay-ness with it. I mean, she's sinning in this, and doing a great evil in your family with it, and you got happy that this boyfriend called her to comfort her in her distress with her husband??? That's just not right. I mean, interesting that it happened as you said, but still not right. At least please make sure that your heart is right with God in how you view all of this for your sake as a growing Christian that needs to keep making sure you're staying healthy as one. Just a concerned observer! lol

kateliz wrote:Vash, I really enjoyed reading your tesitmony about coming to God. In my own life God has a history of giving me the exact book that I need for what I'm dealing with at the time. lol Just gave me two that I'm now joyfully reading, in fact! lol I'm very glad for you.

But your last post disturbs me. I was shocked and dismayed and even a bit angered. I mean, it's very clear that your mother having a boyfriend while not yet divorced is adultery. Gives me cause to greatly sympathize with your father in his anger. How long have they been having a romantic relationship? Did it start before the divorce, or was maybe even part of the cause of it?

But that's not what got me the most. What did get me was your apparent okay-ness with it. I mean, she's sinning in this, and doing a great evil in your family with it, and you got happy that this boyfriend called her to comfort her in her distress with her husband??? That's just not right. I mean, interesting that it happened as you said, but still not right. At least please make sure that your heart is right with God in how you view all of this for your sake as a growing Christian that needs to keep making sure you're staying healthy as one. Just a concerned observer! lol

Kateliz,

Perhaps you're assuming facts not in evidence? The fact that she has a boyfriend doesn't necessarily mean she's committing adultery. But even if she were, that's something between her and God and not for us or even her son to judge.

God bless,

Byblos.

Byblos wrote:

kateliz wrote:Vash, I really enjoyed reading your tesitmony about coming to God. In my own life God has a history of giving me the exact book that I need for what I'm dealing with at the time. lol Just gave me two that I'm now joyfully reading, in fact! lol I'm very glad for you.

But your last post disturbs me. I was shocked and dismayed and even a bit angered. I mean, it's very clear that your mother having a boyfriend while not yet divorced is adultery. Gives me cause to greatly sympathize with your father in his anger. How long have they been having a romantic relationship? Did it start before the divorce, or was maybe even part of the cause of it?

But that's not what got me the most. What did get me was your apparent okay-ness with it. I mean, she's sinning in this, and doing a great evil in your family with it, and you got happy that this boyfriend called her to comfort her in her distress with her husband??? That's just not right. I mean, interesting that it happened as you said, but still not right. At least please make sure that your heart is right with God in how you view all of this for your sake as a growing Christian that needs to keep making sure you're staying healthy as one. Just a concerned observer! lol

Kateliz,

Perhaps you're assuming facts not in evidence? The fact that she has a boyfriend doesn't necessarily mean she's committing adultery. But even if she were, that's something between her and God and not for us or even her son to judge.

God bless,

Byblos.

That's a good word Byblos. Jesus didn't judge the woman at the well even though he knew she had been married 5 times and was living outside the bounds of marriage with a man at the time. Not to say we shouldn't judge righteously, but when we do, we do at our own risk.

Aldultery, Byblos, is more than just sexual contact. Jesus when he said that if you even look at a woman who isn't your wife so as to lust after her it's adultery of the heart. His mom having a boyfriend directly implicates her in adultery. I'm not judging, I'm concerned about the obvious.

I am a bit uncomfortable with the situation in general, but even I am leaving it between her and God. I pray for my dad, and in fact just recently had a pastor pray with me for him, and the whole family.

I know it's not right, but like I said, I'm leaving it up to God to judge. Even I don't know the whole situation. In fact, things were just recently brought to my attention about their (my parents') past from before I was even born. And with the information that I recieved about their past, I'm a bit split on the whole thing. So I'm not judging.

Thank you for your concern, though. And if you still think I'm doing something wrong, please do let me know as I do want to grow, as you alluded to (and that goes for anyone else reading this too).

-Vash

EDIT:

Also, my appologies if I offended or angered you (as I apparently did), or anyone else who read that. But yes, if you still think I'm in the wrong in any way, please let me know. As I said in my first testimony, I'm a relatively new-believer and I need to grow.

Wow Vash, you've shown a lot of maturity there. I am sorry if I came off pretty strong or too assuming, just know that I did mean all in concerned Sisterly love. I wasn't angered at you at all, just your mother. I only felt symthathy for you being in the middle of it all, and also your newly coming to Christ while having to deal with this situation. I really respect your desire to leave your parents with God on all of this, and that is I'm sure really going to help you through all of this.

kateliz wrote:Aldultery, Byblos, is more than just sexual contact. Jesus when he said that if you even look at a woman who isn't your wife so as to lust after her it's adultery of the heart. His mom having a boyfriend directly implicates her in adultery. I'm not judging, I'm concerned about the obvious.

Jesus was making sure we understand we are sinners at heart and hence the need for our total dependence on him. He was not in effect instituting the mere thought of adultery as a sin. But even if it were, do you really know what's in their hearts?

Byblos wrote:Jesus was making sure we understand we are sinners at heart and hence the need for our total dependence on him. He was not in effect instituting the mere thought of adultery as a sin.

Byblos, Jesus was not instituting it because it already was a sin. The outward physical act started from a sinful thought. He made it pretty clear that to look upon a woman to lust after her was the same as committing the act of adultery itself...or maybe I misunderstood your point. It wouldn't be the first time.

I believe the point is:

Byblos wrote: Jesus was making sure we understand we are sinners at heart and hence the need for our total dependence on him.

... and it is fundamental to the entire gospel message.
We are totally dependent on Jesus for the restoration of a right relationship with God, for our redemption, for our salvation. Without Him we are lost forever as we simply cannot do any of that for ourselves.
That is a foundation principle of Christianity, related to the verse in my signature below:

Speaking of this situation, suppose I did feel judgemental (I don't, but I'm just speaking hypothetically since I'm curious as to this question I'm going to ask), wouldn't I automatically be in the wrong for doing so because as my mom's son, I "shalt respect thy mother and father".

And well, judging my mom in a negative light.... I'm sure you all know where I'm getting at here, but isn't that considered disrespectful to my mother? Doesn't that commandment still apply even in the face of sin?

Just a few quick thoughts...

Perhaps it is too easy to confuse judgement with lack of respect and love.

Consider the encounter that Jesus had with the woman at the well (John 4) - the woman who said she had no husband, yet she had had five husbands and the man she was living with was not her husband.
Did Jesus, in seeking her honesty and pointing out her sin, not also show her respect and His love for all?
He did not ignore her sin, but He treated her with respect and in love revealed His identity to her.

One must be able to recognize and identify what is sin, rather than ignore it. Adding a self-righteous unforgiving response is taking judgement beyond that with which we are charged to do. We are told to forgive others so that God will forgive us also. If we don't forgive, we cannot expect His forgiveness either.

Ignoring the sin of another Christian may be the most unloving thing we can do for them, but this is among those within the Christian brotherhood rather than those outside the faith. 1 Corinthians 5:11-13

Respect is an attitude that holds the other in esteem, that values the other, that regards the other as just as important in God's eyes as oneself.

You can definitely still respect and love someone while appreciating that their actions are sinful, and if they are a brother or sister in Christ, with all humility pointing out in love that they are persisting in sin.

If the other is not a Christian, then pointing out sin may well be inappropriate.

Judah wrote:I believe the point is:

Byblos wrote: Jesus was making sure we understand we are sinners at heart and hence the need for our total dependence on him.

... and it is fundamental to the entire gospel message.
We are totally dependent on Jesus for the restoration of a right relationship with God, for our redemption, for our salvation. Without Him we are lost forever as we simply cannot do any of that for ourselves.
That is a foundation principle of Christianity, related to the verse in my signature below:

That was exactly the broader message. All sins start with a mere thought, not just adultery and that's because we're all sinners at heart. The other point was that judgment is also his.

I'm just a bit flabergasted here. Aren't we being a bit too "politically correct" in our concern over whether we're, (I'm, to be more specific,) judging here or not??? I mean, come on! The woman has a boyfriend while she's still married.

.......

*sigh* And I could say the same thing about some of you judging me and my own heart as you have claimed I've done toward Vash's mother. I see real hypocrisy here. You've judged me based on evidence of what I've written, and so have I for this lady.

Here's the thing, I wasn't talking to her. I was speaking to her son, who it seemed to me accepted this sin without qualm. As a fellow Christian I felt obligated to point this out for his benefit. And if I were to talk to her, I would do it in love, with sympathy for her sinful human condition, humility on my part, and speak truth to her with all that.

But nevertheless, are we not forgetting here how the apostles spoke to hard-hearted sinners? And as well, how Christ Himself did too? He sought repentence from people, but for unremorseful people He was just in His displeasure.

I, in speaking only to the son, and with seeing in his post that her current state is in delight over this boyfriend as such, feel I was not being unjust or unChristian in my responding post towars her.