Good points Someguy20
However, with children- it seems quite complicated. Then, surely, how is it "fair" in our view that someone who wass never given a chance to sin goes to hevaen? I mean, surely, would not WE have rather wished to have never been given a chance (say, been killed before age of acountablitiy or been aborted etc) so then we could not have messed anything up? How is it fair to us that we have to endure hardships and suffering and make our choices while others never had to say yes or no and go to heaven "undeserved"? What then is the gift of life - this life here full of misery and pain and suffering (+ some joys, but there IS pain and evil) or the true life which follows after this one? On what basis can a baby go to heaven, if we people who had to suffer and make choices have a chance to mess up on our way to heaven?
I know many would say abbies go to heaven; some believe in limbo but i think that's unbiblical nor it is supported by the Church.
And as no-one is perfect, then, isn't it rather to do with our inherent nature as human beings rather than something individual? i mean, if you take an analogy: a person A falls asleep at lectures when professor X teaches. If no-one else but person A falls asleep at X's lectures, and person A also falls asleep at other lecturer's lectures, we can make an attribution about person A that he may be uninterested, and infer something from A's behavior; that is, we say person A is "faulty" in some way. However, if person A falls asleep on person X's lectures and other people also fall alsep at |X's lectures but not in others, surely that has to do something with person X? So, if we go by that, if EVERYONE is sinful and NOONE is perfect, then, isn't rather something to do with how the things are in the world, the situation, as well as our inherent nature, something about humanity IN GENERAL rather than something for which we should be blamed as individuals? imean, if jesus werent god, he would have not been perfect; if I or you were god then we would be perfect. God cannot be imperfect simply because of His nature. But because we are sinful by nature and cannot really help it, then is it really ok that we are still held responsible for it? Sure, God gave us His SOn (and thanks im for that!!
) but i still dont understand why we should feel somehow ashamed for having such a nature, i mean; if God wanted to create us sinless then we would have been, so it has to do something with our nature and the situation rather than us as individuals.
Also, if we then consider that babies go to heaven because they never had a chance to sin, then that is not something to do with them as individuals but rather due to their nature - that because they hadn't reach AoA then they are not responsible; however I am 100% sure that as soon asthey would have reached AoA then they would have sinned, so if we were all given a chance we would've sinned; so how are we any different and why should the babies be somehow "better off" than we are in this sense just because they were never given an oportunity to be evil due to their nature??
Ofc, im a believer etc but it is one of the things i dont fully understand, so if u have some insight please share it
"Love is only possible if a choice of either love or rejecting the love is given." One of the most true things id ever heard, not so long ago.
-MMS-