Yhwhhallowed wrote: Kurieuo wrote: Yhwhhallowed wrote: Kurieuo wrote:
Yhwhhallowed wrote:If anyone has questions that require sincere answering about Jehovah's Witnesses. I will do my best to fill in the gaps for you, although i am not personally a Jehovah's Witness I was raised in the knowledge my entire life. I am not baptised into it or any other religion but had the pleasure in studying the small differences of many different forms of of Christianity as a whole. From Catholic beliefs to Methodist from Baptists to Pentecostals. Give me your question.
I love JWs. Everything is largely kept superficial with JWs who currently visit me.
They drop off their book, have a quick chat and away they go to return a month later.
But, how would they respond to John 1 with Jesus being the creator of everything that was ever created?
Read this http://www.biblicalunitarian.com/videos/but-what-about-john-1-1
That doesn't resolve the passage.
It ignores John 1:14-15 where logos
is clearly identified as Jesus.
And so, John 1:1-3 still appears to be a thorn in the side of JW's who believe Jesus was created:
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was in the beginning with God. 3 All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.
It seems to me you have to do some rather mental gymnastics with Scripture to avoid this conclusion.
But, it's worse. Because in JW's Bible they re-interpret verse 1 as "the Word was a god."
Why bother to do that if we are simply talking about God's wisdom?
It seems to me that there was a revisionist attempt to smooth over the fact this was referring to Jesus, since they believe Jesus was not Jehovah God, but a god -- an angel.
But, this interpretation is undone in verse 3 where everything that has come into existence was created by "a god".
Clearly, the logos
in verse 1 is not "a god", but the God since only God is uncreated.
Here this should clear some things up for you http://www.jw.org/en/publications/magazines/wp20090401/is-jesus-god/#?insight[search_id]=ae44e602-5b69-4b91-9570-29e80811b366&insight[search_result_index]=0
That doesn't really help to clarify much the JW's position.
Further, I'm not using John 1 to argue for the Trinity, but for the Word being Jehovah rather than "a god".
Your previous reply (prior to editing) was one I was familiar with going back to the first JW couple who visited me.
That is, Jesus was alongside Jehovah who spoke into existence everything through Jesus who created. Something like that.
I really admired the woman in that first couple. She was so sincere and seemed to care.
Her partner though just wanted out of there. Made me feel of the devil and too heretical to be saved.
In any case, it all sparked the start of me critically analysing my Christian beliefs.
Yet, it is in John 1:3 that we see: "All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.
John is here careful to point out all things created
came into being through the Word -- which is "a god" according to the JW translation.
So much so, that John stresses "nothing came into being that has come into being
" through this Word which was a god.
Thus, the Word identified as "a god" is uncreated.
For if this god were created, then it would have had to have created himself through himself (which is a contradiction of sorts).
So then, what makes better sense in John 1 -- that the Word was the uncreated Jehovah or "a god"?
PS. Since you're not a JW, you can concede if you think I'm making a good point.
It is not good to build up a whole case on one passage alone. So I would not expect this one passage to cause a JW to stop being a JW.