Must Jesus be God..

Discussions surrounding the various other faiths who deviate from mainstream Christian doctrine such as LDS and the Jehovah's Witnesses.
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Re: Must Jesus be God..

Postby PaulSacramento » Mon Dec 29, 2014 1:19 pm

People who deny that Christ is God are those that believe that by God it is meant "The Father".
So Jesus praying to God or asking God for help is Him praying to the Father ( which is of course, correct) and so, as the view goes, Jesus by being God is being His OWN FATHER since, of course, God = The Father.
The confusion starts here and just grows because what they end of disputing is NOT what the Trinity says ( That Father and Son and HS share the same nature, so all are God) but what they THINK it says based on what THEY decide it says, that Jesus being God = Jesus being His own father.

It is simply this:
Father, Son and HS share the same nature, ie: they are divine.
Then Jesus, the son of God, is God.
Does that make Him His father? of course not BUT it does mean that He has the same divine qualities as His Father.

In regards to the being subject to His father, that has nothing to do with His nature, nothing at all.
My father and I ( God rest His soul) had the same nature YET I was subject to My Father for His virtue of being My father.

The time issue that some bring up, that at one point there must have been ONLY the Father, is one that it seems those people don't truly understand what they are insinuating because IF at one point there was only "The Father" ( of course He would not be The Father since He would not be the father of anything) then that means that The Father was NOT complete, not whole because He had no one to direct His love to, so His love would have been self-centered and if that was the case, He would not be God.

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Re: Must Jesus be God..

Postby abelcainsbrother » Mon Dec 29, 2014 11:56 pm

TheQuestor wrote:
abelcainsbrother wrote:John 1:1,Titus 2:13,John 10:33.Hebrews 1:8,Philippians 2:6,Colossians 2:9,Isaiah 9:6,Romans 9:5,2nd Peter 1:1,John 20:28,Acts 20:28,2nd Timothy 3:16,1st John 5:20,Colossians 1:15,John 8:24,John 1:18. Prove biblically that Jesus Christ is God and this backs up the trinity also - one God manifested by 3 things God the father,the word/son and the Holy Spirit.


If Jesus is God, who was he calling to for help, when he was on the cross? And does God die?


Everyone of the verses I posted tells us Jesus is God in human flesh and yet you don't believe God's word and instead go on your opinion instead all because it doesn't make sense to you.You should never trust man or his opinions over God's word for you cannot just believe the parts of the bible you choose to accept.Jesus fulfilled all of the law for us he lived a perfect sinless life for us and one of many ways he did it was praying and crying out to God the father because we don't do it so Jesus did it for us.He lived a perfect life for us and praying and having a relationship with the father is what he had.Jesus was the word in the flesh living it out before man because man can't because of sin.
Hebrews 12:2-3 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith;who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross,despising the shame,and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

2nd Corinthians 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not,lest the light of this glorious gospel of Christ,who is the image of God,should shine unto them.

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Re: Must Jesus be God..

Postby TheQuestor » Mon Jan 12, 2015 5:12 am

abelcainsbrother wrote:
TheQuestor wrote:
abelcainsbrother wrote:John 1:1,Titus 2:13,John 10:33.Hebrews 1:8,Philippians 2:6,Colossians 2:9,Isaiah 9:6,Romans 9:5,2nd Peter 1:1,John 20:28,Acts 20:28,2nd Timothy 3:16,1st John 5:20,Colossians 1:15,John 8:24,John 1:18. Prove biblically that Jesus Christ is God and this backs up the trinity also - one God manifested by 3 things God the father,the word/son and the Holy Spirit.


If Jesus is God, who was he calling to for help, when he was on the cross? And does God die?


Everyone of the verses I posted tells us Jesus is God in human flesh and yet you don't believe God's word and instead go on your opinion instead all because it doesn't make sense to you.You should never trust man or his opinions over God's word for you cannot just believe the parts of the bible you choose to accept.Jesus fulfilled all of the law for us he lived a perfect sinless life for us and one of many ways he did it was praying and crying out to God the father because we don't do it so Jesus did it for us.He lived a perfect life for us and praying and having a relationship with the father is what he had.Jesus was the word in the flesh living it out before man because man can't because of sin.


If this is true, then God is a human, which might be Jesus purpose, which might have been to tell us that our destiny is to explore the universe, and find new places to create. All might be, just like your assentation's as well.

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Re: Must Jesus be God..

Postby Philip » Mon Jan 12, 2015 8:11 am

If this is true, then God is a human, which might be Jesus purpose, which might have been to tell us that our destiny is to explore the universe, and find new places to create. All might be, just like your assentation's as well.


The Jesus part of our (ONE) God was and IS still human and ALSO fully God! And Jesus has been God FOREVER! He has only remained human since being born into the world through Mary. His purpose was to come to die for the sins of the world and to fulfill the words of God's prophets, to be resurrected, return to heaven and to (in the future) return to earth again for His Bride (His Church). If you wanted to communicate with ants, it would be far more effective for them to understand you if you, yourself, were to also become an ant. That is the idea in God having stepped into history by being born a man (while simultaneously remaining fully God). Jesus was and is the Godman! Remember, history is HIS Story!

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Re: Must Jesus be God..

Postby TheQuestor » Tue Jan 13, 2015 4:33 pm

Philip wrote:
If this is true, then God is a human, which might be Jesus purpose, which might have been to tell us that our destiny is to explore the universe, and find new places to create. All might be, just like your assentation's as well.


The Jesus part of our (ONE) God was and IS still human and ALSO fully God! And Jesus has been God FOREVER! He has only remained human since being born into the world through Mary. His purpose was to come to die for the sins of the world and to fulfill the words of God's prophets, to be resurrected, return to heaven and to (in the future) return to earth again for His Bride (His Church). If you wanted to communicate with ants, it would be far more effective for them to understand you if you, yourself, were to also become an ant. That is the idea in God having stepped into history by being born a man (while simultaneously remaining fully God). Jesus was and is the Godman! Remember, history is HIS Story!


The sad thing about that, it that as long as you say what you are supposed to say, then everyone here is happy.....

The truth, is that this is what Jesus, never did......................

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Re: Must Jesus be God..

Postby Mallz » Tue Jan 13, 2015 4:58 pm

The sad thing about that, it that as long as you say what you are supposed to say, then everyone here is happy.....

The truth, is that this is what Jesus, never did......................


Now what are you talking about?

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Re: Must Jesus be God..

Postby TheQuestor » Tue Jan 13, 2015 5:33 pm

Mallz wrote:
The sad thing about that, it that as long as you say what you are supposed to say, then everyone here is happy.....

The truth, is that this is what Jesus, never did......................


Now what are you talking about?


If you do not understand, that Jesus seldom said or did what he was supposed to, then you ignored him, and threw the stone at the prostitute.

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Re: Must Jesus be God..

Postby Mallz » Tue Jan 13, 2015 6:18 pm

:pound: :wave:

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Re: Must Jesus be God..

Postby TheQuestor » Tue Jan 13, 2015 6:44 pm

Mallz wrote::pound: :wave:


Agreed........., he also accepted a tax collector into his group..................

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Re: Must Jesus be God..

Postby abelcainsbrother » Tue Jan 13, 2015 7:44 pm

TheQuestor wrote:
Mallz wrote::pound: :wave:


Agreed........., he also accepted a tax collector into his group..................


And a doctor. Calling Dr. Luke. For you.
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=asmFWJqJfBw

Also ,God's blood

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2jQe58JOx-w
Hebrews 12:2-3 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith;who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross,despising the shame,and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

2nd Corinthians 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not,lest the light of this glorious gospel of Christ,who is the image of God,should shine unto them.

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Re: Must Jesus be God..

Postby jpbg33 » Mon Mar 02, 2015 5:16 pm

Well to answer the question that he said he asked. If Jesus had to be God to be the atonement for our sins. That is not what the bible says.

The bible says "Rom 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
Rom 5:13 (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.
Rom 5:14 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.
Rom 5:15 But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.
Rom 5:16 And not as it was by one that sinned, so is the gift: for the judgment was by one to condemnation, but the free gift is of many offences unto justification.
Rom 5:17 For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.)
Rom 5:18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
Rom 5:19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
Rom 5:20 Moreover the law entered, that the offence might abound. But where sin abounded, grace did much more abound:
Rom 5:21 That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.

It didn't say that a God had to die for us to have an atonement for our sins, but that a righteous man must die. The bible also says that all have sinned and came short of the glory of God. So there was no human righteous enough to make the atonement. The only one righteous enough was God the Son (Jesus Christ) .

So dose the atonement have to be made by God yes but only because all men have sinned.

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Re: Must Jesus be God..

Postby jpbg33 » Mon Mar 09, 2015 8:34 am

One other thing about if Jesus called him self God he did. The devil took Jesus up on top of the temple and was tempting Jesus to jump off. Then Jesus said this "Luke 4:12 And Jesus answering said unto him, It is said, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God.". So right there he said he was God. You said you wanted someone to show you where Jesus said He was God. Well there it is.

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Re: Must Jesus be God..

Postby Nessa » Thu Jul 09, 2015 5:11 pm

a little suprised at some of the responses to a honest question. if someone came up to you in the street and asked for directions would just say theres the book store buy the map
just feel some hostility

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Re: Must Jesus be God..

Postby EssentialSacrifice » Mon Jul 13, 2015 5:24 pm

by jpbg33 » Mon Mar 09, 2015 11:34 am

One other thing about if Jesus called him self God he did. The devil took Jesus up on top of the temple and was tempting Jesus to jump off. Then Jesus said this "Luke 4:12 And Jesus answering said unto him, It is said, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God.". So right there he said he was God. You said you wanted someone to show you where Jesus said He was God. Well there it is.

you'd need to include the entire verse jpbg33 to understand it was God the father the devil was tempting to show His hand by saving Jesus from the leap from the temple This verse does not prove Jesus is God, but certainly shows Satan knows Jesus is the son of God (and therefore God).

9 The devil led him to Jerusalem and had him stand on the highest point of the temple. “If you are the Son of God,” he said, “throw yourself down from here. 10 For it is written:
“‘He will command his angels concerning you
to guard you carefully;
11 they will lift you up in their hands,
so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.’[a]”
12 Jesus answered, “It is said: ‘Do not put the Lord your God to the test.’[b]”
Trust the past to God’s mercy, the present to God’s love, and the future to God’s providence. -St Augustine


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