Should Christians divide over the age of the earth?

Discussions on creation beliefs within Christianity, and topics related to creation.
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abelcainsbrother
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Should Christians divide over the age of the earth?

Postby abelcainsbrother » Thu Dec 31, 2015 3:22 am

Here is an intersting discussion I came accross you might like also. As for me I don't believe Christians should divide over the age of the earth or based on what creation theory or interpretation we hold to. Our God is bigger than our differences and we should show mutual respect as a brother or sister in Christ even when we disagree. As you know the church is a body made up of many members but we are all still the body of Christ as long as we are truly saved and born again through Jesus Christ our risen Savior and Lord.

So if and when we do debate and discuss our differing view points please try to remember that on the other end is a brother or sister in Christ who loves Jesus Christ as much you do and is in just as much awe and reverance for how much Jesus truly gave us as believers as you are. God bless you!

Here is the link that made me think about this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fQMfwHFs6Q
Hebrews 12:2-3 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith;who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross,despising the shame,and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

2nd Corinthians 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not,lest the light of this glorious gospel of Christ,who is the image of God,should shine unto them.

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Re: Should Christians divide over the age of the earth?

Postby crochet1949 » Fri Apr 01, 2016 5:47 pm

The age of the earth Is an important question.

How much power do we give God? Since He's been powerful enough to raise Christ from the dead, He must be pretty powerful. So why do we find it difficult to give Him the power to create the world in a week?

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Re: Should Christians divide over the age of the earth?

Postby Audie » Fri Apr 01, 2016 6:39 pm

If there is a god he could have made me 12 ft. tall, instead of 5.

Why speak of what could -have, instead of what is?

The age of the earth is of interest and importance, sure.

Do you know anything about it?

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Re: Should Christians divide over the age of the earth?

Postby abelcainsbrother » Fri Apr 01, 2016 7:13 pm

crochet1949 wrote:The age of the earth Is an important question.

How much power do we give God? Since He's been powerful enough to raise Christ from the dead, He must be pretty powerful. So why do we find it difficult to give Him the power to create the world in a week?


I agree the age of the earth is an important question but it comes down to how we interpret God's word and nature God created,and when the evidence in the earth goes against your interpretion? You should question your interpretation and consider other interpretations. Our faith is not blind and it applies to the age of the earth also and we should not believe an interpretation if the evidence in the earth that shows us the earth is old goes against it. You need to question your interpretation.

It is good when the interpretation you agree with lines up with the evidence in the earth that tells us the earth is old. However,even when it comes to old earth interpretations there are still differences in interpretation that need to be considered.

Like for example some old earth creationists focus on the hebrew word "yom" and making a case for long days in Genesis 1 longer than 24 hour days to make a case for an old earth while others already believe the bible tells us the earth is old without having to focus on the Hebrew word "yom" or stretch out the days to be long periods of time so that it still comes down to interpretations that should be considered. You might even can consider both of these interpretations have some merit and should be considered.

But no matter what interpreetation we choose to go by the bible does not specifically tell us how old the earth is whether you are a young earth creationist or old earth and all we can go on are interpretations and the evidence of nature and of the earth. God left it open for us to search out and discover.
Hebrews 12:2-3 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith;who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross,despising the shame,and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

2nd Corinthians 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not,lest the light of this glorious gospel of Christ,who is the image of God,should shine unto them.

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Re: Should Christians divide over the age of the earth?

Postby RickD » Fri Apr 01, 2016 8:25 pm

crochet1949 wrote:The age of the earth Is an important question.

How much power do we give God? Since He's been powerful enough to raise Christ from the dead, He must be pretty powerful. So why do we find it difficult to give Him the power to create the world in a week?

Why did he need a whole week? He's God! He has the power to do it in an instant!*






*The earth is old. Really, really old. The universe is old. Really, really old. That doesn't mean God couldn't. It just means He didn't.
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Re: Should Christians divide over the age of the earth?

Postby EssentialSacrifice » Fri Apr 01, 2016 8:37 pm

Here is, IMO the best science to bible correlation. the time line is flawless and the elements of time and space accounted for. for those of you who haven't seen this ... take the time, your "creation stance" isn't threatened, it's bolstered ... scientifically. :clap: it makes great sense to me. :)

https://www.scribd.com/fullscreen/12740 ... =slideshow
Trust the past to God’s mercy, the present to God’s love, and the future to God’s providence. -St Augustine

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Re: Should Christians divide over the age of the earth?

Postby crochet1949 » Sun Apr 03, 2016 7:32 pm

RickD -- God didn't Need a whole week-- He took that week and then rested on that last day. It's to be an example to Us. Work for 6 days and Rest on the 7th. He really Did. :)

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Re: Should Christians divide over the age of the earth?

Postby crochet1949 » Sun Apr 03, 2016 8:05 pm

I know that we need to give credit for the existence of the earth to the Person / Entity responsible for it.

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Re: Should Christians divide over the age of the earth?

Postby RickD » Mon Apr 04, 2016 5:26 am

crochet1949 wrote:RickD -- God didn't Need a whole week-- He took that week and then rested on that last day. It's to be an example to Us. Work for 6 days and Rest on the 7th. He really Did. :)

Example to us?

You sure it was to us? Because I thought the 6 to 1 pattern was for ancient Israel. Best not confuse us with ancient Israel. Because once one starts conflating Israel with us, all sorts of bad doctrine follows. Like:

We must follow the law, with all that is included therein.

We are to live by the spirit, not Israel's law.

And it is a pattern of 6 to 1 for Israel. We as Christians have no law that says we work 6 days and rest one.
1 Corinthians 1:9
9 God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

Audie wrote:
"Christianity is not a joke, but it has some very poor representatives."


St. Richard the Sarcastic--The Patron Saint of Irony

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Re: Should Christians divide over the age of the earth?

Postby PaulSacramento » Mon Apr 04, 2016 7:33 am

abelcainsbrother wrote:Here is an intersting discussion I came accross you might like also. As for me I don't believe Christians should divide over the age of the earth or based on what creation theory or interpretation we hold to. Our God is bigger than our differences and we should show mutual respect as a brother or sister in Christ even when we disagree. As you know the church is a body made up of many members but we are all still the body of Christ as long as we are truly saved and born again through Jesus Christ our risen Savior and Lord.

So if and when we do debate and discuss our differing viewpoints please try to remember that on the other end is a brother or sister in Christ who loves Jesus Christ as much you do and is in just as much awe and reverance for how much Jesus truly gave us as believers as you are. God bless you!

Here is the link that made me think about this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fQMfwHFs6Q



No, Christians should not be divided about this.
Not ONE piece of Christian doctrine hinges on God creating the universe in the literal and concrete chronological fashion of Genesis 1.

The reality is that based on the literary genre of Genesis and the wording used, Genesis CAN mean both a literal 6 days of creation or a much longer period.
There have been many ways to reconcile this BUT the truth is that we don't HAVE to reconcile it.

Now, if a person truly believes that there MUST be an answer and they their faith depends on this then yes, this becomes a very crucial element.

That said, a Christian is a follower of a Person, fully Man and fully God.
We don't follow interpretations, we follow HIM.
We don't follow the views of men, we follow HIM.

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Re: Should Christians divide over the age of the earth?

Postby crochet1949 » Mon Apr 04, 2016 8:59 am

RickD. --- ancient Israel didn't exist -- No one existed, yet. Israel came from the 12 tribes of Jacob. God renamed Jacob / Israel. The tribe of Judah. Abraham was picked from the Hebrew world and several generations later Jacob came on the scene. Abraham was saved by Faith -- just like everyone else is. The Law was given to Israel / God's chosen people. But it was given to show the need For salvation. No one could ever be 'good enough' through trying to keep every law to earn their own way to heaven.

SO -- the 6 days and rest 1 was given to Mankind as an example for living. After the cross - Christ's bodily resurrection from the dead was on the 1st day of the week. Sunday. That's why a lot of us worship on The Lord's Day -- Sunday. Rather than keeping the Sabbath Day holy.

The importance Is -- do we give God the Power To do the creating exactly as He's told us in Genesis. Is His Word our authority or not. His Word tells us Lots of very important information.

Yes, we follow Him -- and He has given us His Word / Bible.

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Re: Should Christians divide over the age of the earth?

Postby RickD » Mon Apr 04, 2016 1:06 pm

crochet wrote:
RickD. --- ancient Israel didn't exist -- No one existed, yet. Israel came from the 12 tribes of Jacob. God renamed Jacob / Israel. The tribe of Judah. Abraham was picked from the Hebrew world and several generations later Jacob came on the scene. Abraham was saved by Faith -- just like everyone else is. The Law was given to Israel / God's chosen people. But it was given to show the need For salvation. No one could ever be 'good enough' through trying to keep every law to earn their own way to heaven.


No matter what one believes about the different creation beliefs, the story about Adam and Eve is showing that Adam was the first human in the lineage of Christ. That lineage is the same one that became Israel. The OT beginning with Genesis, is the story of the nation of Israel, and its redeemer.

SO -- the 6 days and rest 1 was given to Mankind as an example for living. After the cross - Christ's bodily resurrection from the dead was on the 1st day of the week. Sunday. That's why a lot of us worship on The Lord's Day -- Sunday. Rather than keeping the Sabbath Day holy.

It's 6 periods of time to 1 period of rest. It wasn't meant as a literal 24 hour day. Just look at the sabbath months, and sabbath years. They follow the same 6 to 1 pattern, yet aren't literally 24 hour days.

The importance Is -- do we give God the Power To do the creating exactly as He's told us in Genesis. Is His Word our authority or not. His Word tells us Lots of very important information

Of course. I'm not arguing that He didn't create exactly how He said He did in scripture. Scripture literally says that He created in 6 yoms. The text doesn't literally say He created in six 24 hour days. Your interpretation is not equal to scripture. As much as you want to think it is, it's simply not. I take scripture very seriously. So please don't tell me that I'm not reading it literally, when it comes to the creation days.

Yes, we follow Him -- and He has given us His Word / Bible.

Amen. And we all could do well if we aren't dogmatic on secondary or even tertiary issues such as creation days.

Please don't take my disagreement with your Young Earth view personally. I used to be a YEC. I used to swallow hook, line and sinker, the whole Ken Ham-YEC-way-or-no-way belief system.

I've just grown really tired when people equate their non essential creation beliefs with scripture itself.
1 Corinthians 1:9
9 God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

Audie wrote:
"Christianity is not a joke, but it has some very poor representatives."


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Re: Should Christians divide over the age of the earth?

Postby Audie » Wed Apr 06, 2016 6:09 am

RickD wrote:
crochet wrote:
RickD. --- ancient Israel didn't exist -- No one existed, yet. Israel came from the 12 tribes of Jacob. God renamed Jacob / Israel. The tribe of Judah. Abraham was picked from the Hebrew world and several generations later Jacob came on the scene. Abraham was saved by Faith -- just like everyone else is. The Law was given to Israel / God's chosen people. But it was given to show the need For salvation. No one could ever be 'good enough' through trying to keep every law to earn their own way to heaven.


No matter what one believes about the different creation beliefs, the story about Adam and Eve is showing that Adam was the first human in the lineage of Christ. That lineage is the same one that became Israel. The OT beginning with Genesis, is the story of the nation of Israel, and its redeemer.

SO -- the 6 days and rest 1 was given to Mankind as an example for living. After the cross - Christ's bodily resurrection from the dead was on the 1st day of the week. Sunday. That's why a lot of us worship on The Lord's Day -- Sunday. Rather than keeping the Sabbath Day holy.

It's 6 periods of time to 1 period of rest. It wasn't meant as a literal 24 hour day. Just look at the sabbath months, and sabbath years. They follow the same 6 to 1 pattern, yet aren't literally 24 hour days.

The importance Is -- do we give God the Power To do the creating exactly as He's told us in Genesis. Is His Word our authority or not. His Word tells us Lots of very important information

Of course. I'm not arguing that He didn't create exactly how He said He did in scripture. Scripture literally says that He created in 6 yoms. The text doesn't literally say He created in six 24 hour days. Your interpretation is not equal to scripture. As much as you want to think it is, it's simply not. I take scripture very seriously. So please don't tell me that I'm not reading it literally, when it comes to the creation days.

Yes, we follow Him -- and He has given us His Word / Bible.

Amen. And we all could do well if we aren't dogmatic on secondary or even tertiary issues such as creation days.

Please don't take my disagreement with your Young Earth view personally. I used to be a YEC. I used to swallow hook, line and sinker, the whole Ken Ham-YEC-way-or-no-way belief system.

I've just grown really tired when people equate their non essential creation beliefs with scripture itself.


How do you feel about people claiming that the god you and they worship is guilty of
such a horrific act as drowning all living things, save a boatload?

How did you recover from the Vice of YEC, btw?

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Re: Should Christians divide over the age of the earth?

Postby RickD » Wed Apr 06, 2016 6:19 am

Audie wrote:
RickD wrote:
crochet wrote:
RickD. --- ancient Israel didn't exist -- No one existed, yet. Israel came from the 12 tribes of Jacob. God renamed Jacob / Israel. The tribe of Judah. Abraham was picked from the Hebrew world and several generations later Jacob came on the scene. Abraham was saved by Faith -- just like everyone else is. The Law was given to Israel / God's chosen people. But it was given to show the need For salvation. No one could ever be 'good enough' through trying to keep every law to earn their own way to heaven.


No matter what one believes about the different creation beliefs, the story about Adam and Eve is showing that Adam was the first human in the lineage of Christ. That lineage is the same one that became Israel. The OT beginning with Genesis, is the story of the nation of Israel, and its redeemer.

SO -- the 6 days and rest 1 was given to Mankind as an example for living. After the cross - Christ's bodily resurrection from the dead was on the 1st day of the week. Sunday. That's why a lot of us worship on The Lord's Day -- Sunday. Rather than keeping the Sabbath Day holy.

It's 6 periods of time to 1 period of rest. It wasn't meant as a literal 24 hour day. Just look at the sabbath months, and sabbath years. They follow the same 6 to 1 pattern, yet aren't literally 24 hour days.

The importance Is -- do we give God the Power To do the creating exactly as He's told us in Genesis. Is His Word our authority or not. His Word tells us Lots of very important information

Of course. I'm not arguing that He didn't create exactly how He said He did in scripture. Scripture literally says that He created in 6 yoms. The text doesn't literally say He created in six 24 hour days. Your interpretation is not equal to scripture. As much as you want to think it is, it's simply not. I take scripture very seriously. So please don't tell me that I'm not reading it literally, when it comes to the creation days.

Yes, we follow Him -- and He has given us His Word / Bible.

Amen. And we all could do well if we aren't dogmatic on secondary or even tertiary issues such as creation days.

Please don't take my disagreement with your Young Earth view personally. I used to be a YEC. I used to swallow hook, line and sinker, the whole Ken Ham-YEC-way-or-no-way belief system.

I've just grown really tired when people equate their non essential creation beliefs with scripture itself.


How do you feel about people claiming that the god you and they worship is guilty of
such a horrific act as drowning all living things, save a boatload?

How did you recover from the Vice of YEC, btw?

Audie,

I don't believe God drowned all living things. Animals that weren't in the area of the local flood at Noah's time, weren't drowned.

Killing is not wrong if it's justified killing. And if God kills someone, who am I to say it wasn't justified. Of course my answer assumes first, the existence of an omnipotent God. So, I don't expect someone who doesn't believe in God to come to the same conclusion.

And as far as recovering from YEC, as you asked? For me personally, I just started studying the subject more on my own. That's when I stopped believing in YEC.

But again, YEC, OEC, TE, it really is a meaningless conversation to have with someone who doesn't acknowledge the very existence of God.
1 Corinthians 1:9
9 God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

Audie wrote:
"Christianity is not a joke, but it has some very poor representatives."


St. Richard the Sarcastic--The Patron Saint of Irony

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Re: Should Christians divide over the age of the earth?

Postby Byblos » Wed Apr 06, 2016 8:36 am

RickD wrote:
Audie wrote:How do you feel about people claiming that the god you and they worship is guilty of
such a horrific act as drowning all living things, save a boatload?

How did you recover from the Vice of YEC, btw?

Audie,

I don't believe God drowned all living things. Animals that weren't in the area of the local flood at Noah's time, weren't drowned.

Killing is not wrong if it's justified killing. And if God kills someone, who am I to say it wasn't justified. Of course my answer assumes first, the existence of an omnipotent God. So, I don't expect someone who doesn't believe in God to come to the same conclusion.

And as far as recovering from YEC, as you asked? For me personally, I just started studying the subject more on my own. That's when I stopped believing in YEC.

But again, YEC, OEC, TE, it really is a meaningless conversation to have with someone who doesn't acknowledge the very existence of God.


Exactly. It's like asking why a clay pot is misshapen while refusing to acknowledge the potter exists. Utterly incoherent.
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