Should I do as I please? y:-/

Healthy skepticism of ALL worldviews is good. Skeptical of non-belief like found in Atheism? Post your challenging questions. Responses are encouraged.
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Re: Should I do as I please? y:-/

Postby RickD » Tue May 17, 2016 2:53 pm

Kenny wrote:
Kurieuo wrote:Well, if I didn't believe in God, seriously believed when I died that was it, I'd sure do more as I please, and likely to my detriment. Perhaps that shows a character flaw, really I see such as being pragmatic. What is useful and beneficial to me, that is what I'd do and pursue. Why, I think I'd be a quite scary person to be around.

Do me a favor; maintain your religion. Don't allow anybody to cause you to loose your faith in God; because I would hate to see what you might be capable of if you did.

Ken

How does one loose faith? And would that mean one could tight faith as well?

Loose vs lose

If I had a nickel for every time someone wrote loose... 8-}2
1 Corinthians 1:9
9 God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

Audie wrote:
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Re: Should I do as I please? y:-/

Postby Nessa » Tue May 17, 2016 2:56 pm

If we believe there is no God, then, yes, ultimately we are free to live as we please. And, well, why shouldn't we? If we live in a 'good' way, then who is defining that it is 'good'. If we live in a 'bad' way then who is defining it is 'bad'? Depends who you ask really y:-?

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Re: Should I do as I please? y:-/

Postby RickD » Tue May 17, 2016 3:13 pm

Nessa wrote:If we believe there is no God, then, yes, ultimately we are free to live as we please. And, well, why shouldn't we? If we live in a 'good' way, then who is defining that it is 'good'. If we live in a 'bad' way then who is defining it is 'bad'? Depends who you ask really y:-?

If we believe there is a God, are we not free to live as we please?
1 Corinthians 1:9
9 God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

Audie wrote:
"Christianity is not a joke, but it has some very poor representatives."


St. Richard the Sarcastic--The Patron Saint of Irony

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Re: Should I do as I please? y:-/

Postby Kurieuo » Tue May 17, 2016 3:19 pm

Nicki wrote:
Kurieuo wrote:Well, if I didn't believe in God, seriously believed when I died that was it, I'd sure do more as I please, and likely to my detriment. Perhaps that shows a character flaw, really I see such as being pragmatic. What is useful and beneficial to me, that is what I'd do and pursue. Why, I think I'd be a quite scary person to be around.


Hmm. But you think so deeply about things. Would you really be that self-centred?

Self-centred? Of course, it'd be my purpose in life to be that way.
I'm an either all-in person, or all-out. If I feel I'd do something half-assed, then I'd just not do it at all.
So then, if I really believed God didn't exist, then I'd live life accordingly.

Think about it, what's it matter to be like Hitler or Mother Teresa if the end is all the same?
Should I pretend there is some half-assed meaning to being giving to others? No, such are evolutionary vestiges to be shaken off, I'm not going to believe a lie born in my nature like things really matter. What matters, is what matters to me, and that is what gives me the most enjoyment in the only life I'll have.

No it just so might happen, my self-centredness aligns with being nice to someone. Perhaps it makes me feel good. It might align with not killing someone, and being more political to get my way. It might involve maiming someone who has threatened me, perhaps even demanding things from people. Certainly if I feel crossed, I'd ensure the person never even thought of doing such again. My life is mine and about me, and when you fully believe it, that's scary.

Nicky wrote:Working in early childhood education and care I see social morality reflected in the Australian Early Years Learning Framework, which has been around for a few years now. One of the five learning outcomes is 'children are connected with and contribute to their world', which involves considering others, being aware of fairness and having empathy. Developing these qualities in children is obviously seen as contributing to a good society - nearly everyone wants the next generation to be responsible citizens and not crims, thugs and hoons.

Sure they do, because we all have a moral nature that can intuit right and wrong. It's not relevant though to me. Like I say, I'm not one to be half-assed. If I seriously believe I was going to die, then I'd use to my advantage those who see meaning to such values. And in reality, just because one isn't a crim, doesn't mean they accept -- there are very manipulative people in the world who seem nice and charismatic, but they're simply being more tactful and beneath it all are the most morally bankrupt and self-centred people you'll ever know.
"Whoever will call on the name of the Lord will be saved." (Romans 10:13)

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Re: Should I do as I please? y:-/

Postby Nessa » Tue May 17, 2016 3:20 pm

RickD wrote:
Nessa wrote:If we believe there is no God, then, yes, ultimately we are free to live as we please. And, well, why shouldn't we? If we live in a 'good' way, then who is defining that it is 'good'. If we live in a 'bad' way then who is defining it is 'bad'? Depends who you ask really y:-?

If we believe there is a God, are we not free to live as we please?

Not if we are a Christian, no.

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Re: Should I do as I please? y:-/

Postby RickD » Tue May 17, 2016 3:26 pm

Nessa wrote:
RickD wrote:
Nessa wrote:If we believe there is no God, then, yes, ultimately we are free to live as we please. And, well, why shouldn't we? If we live in a 'good' way, then who is defining that it is 'good'. If we live in a 'bad' way then who is defining it is 'bad'? Depends who you ask really y:-?

If we believe there is a God, are we not free to live as we please?

Not if we are a Christian, no.

Huh?

I'm living everyday as I please. Isn't New Zealand a free country where you can live as you please?

If I want to live according to the spirit, I do. If I want to live according to the flesh, I do. God gave us the freedom to live as we please.
1 Corinthians 1:9
9 God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

Audie wrote:
"Christianity is not a joke, but it has some very poor representatives."


St. Richard the Sarcastic--The Patron Saint of Irony

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Re: Should I do as I please? y:-/

Postby Nessa » Tue May 17, 2016 3:32 pm

RickD wrote:
Nessa wrote:
RickD wrote:
Nessa wrote:If we believe there is no God, then, yes, ultimately we are free to live as we please. And, well, why shouldn't we? If we live in a 'good' way, then who is defining that it is 'good'. If we live in a 'bad' way then who is defining it is 'bad'? Depends who you ask really y:-?

If we believe there is a God, are we not free to live as we please?

Not if we are a Christian, no.

Huh?

I'm living everyday as I please. Isn't New Zealand a free country where you can live as you please?

If I want to live according to the spirit, I do. If I want to live according to the flesh, I do. God gave us the freedom to live as we please.


So are you saying we can be a true christian and live totally for ourselves?

Is that really Christianity?

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Re: Should I do as I please? y:-/

Postby RickD » Tue May 17, 2016 3:37 pm

Nessa wrote:
RickD wrote:
Nessa wrote:
RickD wrote:
Nessa wrote:If we believe there is no God, then, yes, ultimately we are free to live as we please. And, well, why shouldn't we? If we live in a 'good' way, then who is defining that it is 'good'. If we live in a 'bad' way then who is defining it is 'bad'? Depends who you ask really y:-?

If we believe there is a God, are we not free to live as we please?

Not if we are a Christian, no.

Huh?

I'm living everyday as I please. Isn't New Zealand a free country where you can live as you please?

If I want to live according to the spirit, I do. If I want to live according to the flesh, I do. God gave us the freedom to live as we please.


So are you saying we can be a true christian and live totally for ourselves?

Is that really Christianity?

When did I say that we should live for ourselves?

I said we are free to live as we please.

Again, if I wake up today, and decide I want to give all my money to the poor, I'm free to do that.

If I wake up and decide I'm going to steal from the poor, I'm free to try to do that too.

Of course there are consequences to our actions.

Everybody lives as they please. Whenever you choose to do something, and do it, you are doing as you please.

See?
1 Corinthians 1:9
9 God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

Audie wrote:
"Christianity is not a joke, but it has some very poor representatives."


St. Richard the Sarcastic--The Patron Saint of Irony

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Re: Should I do as I please? y:-/

Postby Storyteller » Tue May 17, 2016 3:41 pm

Always?

I want to drink way more than I actually do. No God and id be drunk every day.
Faith is a knowledge within the heart, beyond the reach of proof - Kahlil Gibran

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Re: Should I do as I please? y:-/

Postby RickD » Tue May 17, 2016 3:47 pm

Storyteller wrote:Always?

I want to drink way more than I actually do. No God and id be drunk every day.

You're still free to do that, aren't you? Of course you know the consequences, and you freely choose not to. So, you are doing as you please/choose.
1 Corinthians 1:9
9 God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

Audie wrote:
"Christianity is not a joke, but it has some very poor representatives."


St. Richard the Sarcastic--The Patron Saint of Irony

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Re: Should I do as I please? y:-/

Postby Storyteller » Tue May 17, 2016 3:49 pm

Choose, yes. Please, no.

I see a difference.
Faith is a knowledge within the heart, beyond the reach of proof - Kahlil Gibran

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Re: Should I do as I please? y:-/

Postby RickD » Tue May 17, 2016 3:52 pm

Storyteller wrote:Choose, yes. Please, no.

I see a difference.

Then in context of the discussion, tell me how atheists are free to live as they please, but theists aren't.

Living as I please, just means doing what I choose to do.
http://www.dictionary.com/browse/as-you-please
1 Corinthians 1:9
9 God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

Audie wrote:
"Christianity is not a joke, but it has some very poor representatives."


St. Richard the Sarcastic--The Patron Saint of Irony

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Re: Should I do as I please? y:-/

Postby Nessa » Tue May 17, 2016 3:53 pm

RickD wrote:
Nessa wrote:
RickD wrote:
Nessa wrote:
RickD wrote:If we believe there is a God, are we not free to live as we please?

Not if we are a Christian, no.

Huh?

I'm living everyday as I please. Isn't New Zealand a free country where you can live as you please?

If I want to live according to the spirit, I do. If I want to live according to the flesh, I do. God gave us the freedom to live as we please.


So are you saying we can be a true christian and live totally for ourselves?

Is that really Christianity?

When did I say that we should live for ourselves?

I said we are free to live as we please.

Again, if I wake up today, and decide I want to give all my money to the poor, I'm free to do that.

If I wake up and decide I'm going to steal from the poor, I'm free to try to do that too.

Of course there are consequences to our actions.

Everybody lives as they please. Whenever you choose to do something, and do it, you are doing as you please.

See?


If we are free to live as we please then that includes the choice to live for ourselves, doesn't it?

I don't see Paul in the NT seeing himself as a free man. If he was more free, maybe he wouldnt have been so tortured by recognising his sinfulness.

I think we are free in the sense that God wont stop us from sinning, BUT if we actually see ourselves as free to do whatever we want then I believe we not are truly living for Christ.

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Re: Should I do as I please? y:-/

Postby Storyteller » Tue May 17, 2016 3:57 pm

:amen:

Well said.
Faith is a knowledge within the heart, beyond the reach of proof - Kahlil Gibran

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Re: Should I do as I please? y:-/

Postby RickD » Tue May 17, 2016 4:00 pm

Nessa wrote:

If we are free to live as we please then that includes the choice to live for ourselves, doesn't it?

I don't see Paul in the NT seeing himself as a free man. If he was more free, maybe he wouldnt have been so tortured by recognising his sinfulness.

I think we are free in the sense that God wont stop us from sinning, BUT if we actually see ourselves as free to do whatever we want then I believe we not are truly living for Christ.


Again, living as we please, just means doing whatever we choose to do. We are free to do what we choose.

I'm not saying that we shouldn't do what's right. I'm just saying that we are as free to do as we choose, as an atheist is.

Free to live as we please, just means we are free to make choices. It's an idiom.

Just because we are free to choose, that doesn't mean we shouldn't choose what's good.
1 Corinthians 1:9
9 God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

Audie wrote:
"Christianity is not a joke, but it has some very poor representatives."


St. Richard the Sarcastic--The Patron Saint of Irony


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