A letter to an anti-nationalist pastor

Discussions about politics and goings on around the world. (Please keep discussions civil!)
ultimate777
Senior Member
Posts: 736
Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2011 2:06 am
Christian: Yes
Sex: Male
Creation Position: Undecided

Re: A letter to an anti-nationalist pastor

Post by ultimate777 »

abelcainsbrother wrote:
ultimate777 wrote:
RickD wrote:Warning Nazi comparison ahead!

America allied with Stalin, an evil man, to defeat a greater evil. An evil which was much more of a threat to the US, and the rest of the world.

Not unlike our alliance with Stalin in WW2, many Americans chose a lesser evil(Trump), to defeat a greater evil, (Hillary).

Except its the other way around, voting against Hillary was like
people voting for Joe Stalin to defeat the evil Senator Joe McCarthy
in the early '50's would have been.
Don't get me wrong. Joe McCarthy was really bad, no joke.
You do realize that it is treason to put your hand on the bible,swear to uphold and defend the US Constitution and then abandon it for a globalist agenda in secret,don't ya? And this is not even counting the scandals that surround Hillary.So you're just wrong and you're going to be shocked when God exposes the evil that has been going on and you'll see Donald Trump as a saint compared to it.

The thing is the above is as true as 2+2+5, the Earth is flat, and the Sun goes around the Earth, and you know it. Trump is a Russian agent.
ultimate777
Senior Member
Posts: 736
Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2011 2:06 am
Christian: Yes
Sex: Male
Creation Position: Undecided

Re: A letter to an anti-nationalist pastor

Post by ultimate777 »

RickD wrote:
ultimate777 wrote:
RickD wrote:Warning Nazi comparison ahead!

America allied with Stalin, an evil man, to defeat a greater evil. An evil which was much more of a threat to the US, and the rest of the world.

Not unlike our alliance with Stalin in WW2, many Americans chose a lesser evil(Trump), to defeat a greater evil, (Hillary).

Except its the other way around, voting against Hillary was like
people voting for Joe Stalin to defeat the evil Senator Joe McCarthy
in the early '50's would have been.
Don't get me wrong. Joe McCarthy was really bad, no joke.
Ultimate,

My response was an answer to what you said here:


It seems a lot of professing Christians are willing to put up with a lot of stuff
in Trump's behavior towards women, etc.etc., etc., they would not
stick up for in others.
Many Christians "put up with" Trump's behavior, because we are voting for the lesser of two evils.

It's not that many of us love everything about Trump. We just believe that the best and most realistic thing we can do to fight against liberalism, is to vote for Trump.

Some people, with different political views than most American Christians, may think that voting for Hillary was voting for the lesser of two evils.

My point is that we do not live in a world where we usually have one perfect choice. We are constantly choosing the lesser of two evils, to fight a greater evil.
But you got it all wrong, Rick, Hillary was by far the lesser of two evils. Many American Christians were deluded by the Enemy and it was His tricks leading them to walk down the path with His Stooge.
User avatar
Stu
Esteemed Senior Member
Posts: 1401
Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2011 7:32 am
Christian: Yes
Sex: Male
Creation Position: Undecided

Re: A letter to an anti-nationalist pastor

Post by Stu »

ultimate777 wrote:
RickD wrote:
ultimate777 wrote:
RickD wrote:Warning Nazi comparison ahead!

America allied with Stalin, an evil man, to defeat a greater evil. An evil which was much more of a threat to the US, and the rest of the world.

Not unlike our alliance with Stalin in WW2, many Americans chose a lesser evil(Trump), to defeat a greater evil, (Hillary).

Except its the other way around, voting against Hillary was like
people voting for Joe Stalin to defeat the evil Senator Joe McCarthy
in the early '50's would have been.
Don't get me wrong. Joe McCarthy was really bad, no joke.
Ultimate,

My response was an answer to what you said here:


It seems a lot of professing Christians are willing to put up with a lot of stuff
in Trump's behavior towards women, etc.etc., etc., they would not
stick up for in others.
Many Christians "put up with" Trump's behavior, because we are voting for the lesser of two evils.

It's not that many of us love everything about Trump. We just believe that the best and most realistic thing we can do to fight against liberalism, is to vote for Trump.

Some people, with different political views than most American Christians, may think that voting for Hillary was voting for the lesser of two evils.

My point is that we do not live in a world where we usually have one perfect choice. We are constantly choosing the lesser of two evils, to fight a greater evil.
But you got it all wrong, Rick, Hillary was by far the lesser of two evils. Many American Christians were deluded by the Enemy and it was His tricks leading them to walk down the path with His Stooge.
Hillary supports abortion and would probably have started a war with Russia.
She's also a die hard liberal with all that entails (anti-gun, etc.).
Only when the blood runs and the shackles restrain, will the sheep then awake. When all is lost.
User avatar
edwardmurphy
Ultimate Member
Posts: 2302
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 10:45 am
Christian: No
Sex: Male
Creation Position: I don't believe in creation

Re: A letter to an anti-nationalist pastor

Post by edwardmurphy »

Pro gun control isn't necessarily anti-choice. It's not a black and white issue, and I'm not aware of a single mainstream politician trying to ban guns.

My position is actually fairly typical among progressives. I think that the Tiahrt Amendment should be repealed and gun violence should be objectively studies just like any other public safety issue. In the meantime, I have no objection to citizens owning guns. I do object to things like AR-15s with 30+ round magazines being sold to civilians, but that but that's not anti-gun, it's pro-regulation. There's always tension between freedom and safety, and I think that a reasonable middle ground exists for guns, same as it does for cars, exotic pets, and just about everything else.
User avatar
melanie
Esteemed Senior Member
Posts: 1417
Joined: Sat May 10, 2014 3:18 am
Christian: Yes
Sex: Female

Re: A letter to an anti-nationalist pastor

Post by melanie »

Stu wrote:
ultimate777 wrote:
RickD wrote:
ultimate777 wrote:
RickD wrote:Warning Nazi comparison ahead!

America allied with Stalin, an evil man, to defeat a greater evil. An evil which was much more of a threat to the US, and the rest of the world.

Not unlike our alliance with Stalin in WW2, many Americans chose a lesser evil(Trump), to defeat a greater evil, (Hillary).

Except its the other way around, voting against Hillary was like
people voting for Joe Stalin to defeat the evil Senator Joe McCarthy
in the early '50's would have been.
Don't get me wrong. Joe McCarthy was really bad, no joke.
Ultimate,

My response was an answer to what you said here:


It seems a lot of professing Christians are willing to put up with a lot of stuff
in Trump's behavior towards women, etc.etc., etc., they would not
stick up for in others.
Many Christians "put up with" Trump's behavior, because we are voting for the lesser of two evils.

It's not that many of us love everything about Trump. We just believe that the best and most realistic thing we can do to fight against liberalism, is to vote for Trump.

Some people, with different political views than most American Christians, may think that voting for Hillary was voting for the lesser of two evils.

My point is that we do not live in a world where we usually have one perfect choice. We are constantly choosing the lesser of two evils, to fight a greater evil.
But you got it all wrong, Rick, Hillary was by far the lesser of two evils. Many American Christians were deluded by the Enemy and it was His tricks leading them to walk down the path with His Stooge.
Hillary supports abortion and would probably have started a war with Russia.
She's also a die hard liberal with all that entails (anti-gun, etc.).
Thank goodness that you guys chose a leader who was not as keen to war monger as Clinton y#-o
It seems to not really matter who is in power in the US in regards to foreign policy and the meddling and aggression shown towards other nations.
The lesser of two evils is really quite problamtic when the system itself presents the greater evil than who is chosen to progress it.
Past behaviour is the most accurate predictor of future behaviour and by that standard yes the choices of which evil. When the system itself is inherently flawed that is when the outwardly choices reflect the system from which they are born.
I've heard the mantra along the lines or similar 'how did we come to this' or similar 'the choice of two evils' I think a greater question remains.
When a broken system leaves voters questioning the choice of evils or alienates such a vast section of voters by such polar policies that it divides a country to such depths......something is wrong.
And it's not just the candidates!
User avatar
edwardmurphy
Ultimate Member
Posts: 2302
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2015 10:45 am
Christian: No
Sex: Male
Creation Position: I don't believe in creation

Re: A letter to an anti-nationalist pastor

Post by edwardmurphy »

I think part of the problem is that we're allowing pundits, politicians, and the media to define who we are and to do it in a stupidly simplistic manner. People aren't one dimensional, and their beliefs don't fit neatly into boxes like conservative, Republican, Christian, Democrat, progressive, or whatever.

For example, people here think that Obama and I represent the extreme left. I know people whose views actually are representative of the extreme left, and they disagree with Obama and me about the majority of issues. My stepfather is another example. He's a committed progressive Democrat, so of course at this point in the sentence Stu is assuming that he's anti-gun. In reality, he's a combat veteran who owns 3 rifles and a pistol and regularly goes shooting.

None of us is one dimensional. The evil conservative who wouldn't mind if the poor starved in the streets and the liberal who wants to turn America into Soviet Russia are both straw men. Reject the pundits.
User avatar
melanie
Esteemed Senior Member
Posts: 1417
Joined: Sat May 10, 2014 3:18 am
Christian: Yes
Sex: Female

Re: A letter to an anti-nationalist pastole

Post by melanie »

I totally agree edward
The idea of polar extremes is a straw man and perpetrated by the media. At the core of politics the left and right are more closely aligned in policies than the circus would want us to recognise.
Personally I am often labeled as a liberal, leaning heavily towards the left. In my country that equates to being a Labour voter or more so a Green. I have been voting for 20 years and in that time I have taken every election and candidate at face value. I have studied the policies and the candidate and although my vote has majority leaned in one direction, I have voted outside of this based on policy and what I believe to be the best candidate at the time.
I think it is dangerous to be one eyed anything.
But the current environment is one that seeks to divide, that leaves intelligent argument by the wayside for headlines and emotionally driven arguments often flawed in understanding.
The media is lighting the fire to extremist views, it has changed the script of politics. What has happened in the US is a leader who has utilised the trend of social media, the fickleness of a constant stream of thought that leaves fact, truth and integrity by the wayside overtaken by extreme language, huge generalisations, and the politics of fear.
It has deliberately perpetrated the one dimensional idea of its us against them, and by comparison it has been exactly employed by the left.
The intended outcome....??
I think most people want the best outcome for themselves and for their country.
But politics has lost its ability to represent such....
Geopolitics and the industrial war machine has overshadowed internal politics by a far greater agenda. The politics of nation, the policies that defend and grow the internal interests have been bastardised by a perceived threat that further an aggression towards other foreign nations. That aggression has been irrelevant to who is in power... Clinton, Bush, Obama, Trump....
As far as Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria is concerned the same military complex was at play regardless of who was in power.
Its a domestic game of politics and while the masses are distracted, foreign policy continues...
abelcainsbrother
Ultimate Member
Posts: 5016
Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2014 4:31 am
Christian: Yes
Sex: Male
Creation Position: Gap Theory

Re: A letter to an anti-nationalist pastole

Post by abelcainsbrother »

melanie wrote:I totally agree edward
The idea of polar extremes is a straw man and perpetrated by the media. At the core of politics the left and right are more closely aligned in policies than the circus would want us to recognise.
Personally I am often labeled as a liberal, leaning heavily towards the left. In my country that equates to being a Labour voter or more so a Green. I have been voting for 20 years and in that time I have taken every election and candidate at face value. I have studied the policies and the candidate and although my vote has majority leaned in one direction, I have voted outside of this based on policy and what I believe to be the best candidate at the time.
I think it is dangerous to be one eyed anything.
But the current environment is one that seeks to divide, that leaves intelligent argument by the wayside for headlines and emotionally driven arguments often flawed in understanding.
The media is lighting the fire to extremist views, it has changed the script of politics. What has happened in the US is a leader who has utilised the trend of social media, the fickleness of a constant stream of thought that leaves fact, truth and integrity by the wayside overtaken by extreme language, huge generalisations, and the politics of fear.
It has deliberately perpetrated the one dimensional idea of its us against them, and by comparison it has been exactly employed by the left.
The intended outcome....??
I think most people want the best outcome for themselves and for their country.
But politics has lost its ability to represent such....
Geopolitics and the industrial war machine has overshadowed internal politics by a far greater agenda. The politics of nation, the policies that defend and grow the internal interests have been bastardised by a perceived threat that further an aggression towards other foreign nations. That aggression has been irrelevant to who is in power... Clinton, Bush, Obama, Trump....
As far as Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria is concerned the same military complex was at play regardless of who was in power.
Its a domestic game of politics and while the masses are distracted, foreign policy continues...

I know how foreign policy was before Donald Trump but Trump is changing the way we do foreign policy however he did inherit a mess in the middle east and so has to deal with the problem now but you're going to see things change to where America only goes to war if threatened and not costly wars neo-cons like to fight but never win.Trump is not a neo-con but despite this we still have neo-cons in our government trying to get us into war in Syria to remove Assad but that is not Trump's agenda,he only has troops in the middle east to take out ISIS and that is it.US foreign policy now is to box in ISIS including the troops in Afganistan too. You know ISIS was a creation of our CIA along with other countries in the middle east but our foreign policy is changing.And Trump ran on taking out ISIS so he is just fulfilling his campaign promises to take out ISIS. We won't even be going to war with North Korea probably,instead we will negotiate with them,unlike Obama did.Trump wants to focus on making America great again not fighting costly wars for neo-cons they never win while putting our troops at a huge disadvantage in war zones.
Hebrews 12:2-3 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith;who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross,despising the shame,and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

2nd Corinthians 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not,lest the light of this glorious gospel of Christ,who is the image of God,should shine unto them.
Post Reply