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Boy Scouts: Discrimination?

Posted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 10:21 pm
by Ivellious
So, as many of you might know, the Boy Scouts of America have explicitly banned homosexuality (and presumably all other non-heterosexual people) among its scouts and adult leaders. Recently, the organization announced that after a review and a secret vote, Boy scouts will continue to ban these people from participating in scouting.

For the record, I was a cub scout and a boy scout for over a decade, and reluctantly stopped scouting due to a busier schedule and some internal issues within my scout troop. I really did enjoy much of what scouting had to offer. Throughout my experience I met some very good people, both adult leaders and scouts, and made a number of great friendships as well. I certainly feel that my experience was both fun and aided in my growth as a person. Ironically, many of the things that I learned in the boy scouts are in direct contradiction of this ban.

I won't go into detail on everything here, but I will say that I knew several scouts who were gay or bisexual, two even becoming Eagle Scouts. Not once was the Bible ever forced down my throat and not once was I told that homosexuality was not allowed among the scouts. I have only recently found out that I was an "illegal" scout and scout leader myself (agnostics and atheists are also banned, not that I knew that). Clearly many scouts don't even come into the realization that they aren't "straight" until they are fully integrated into the scouting system. Likewise, it seems odd to me that by the rules in place, anyone who has been a good, honest, and hard-working boy scout and realizes that they are gay either face the choice of lying to stay in scouts or coming out and suddenly being worse than worthless by their troop.

I am curious, what do you think about this ban?

Re: Boy Scouts: Discrimination?

Posted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 10:29 pm
by Beanybag
I don't see the point. I was a queer atheist scout, but I never told anyone so I was able to get my Eagle scout out of the BSA. They have the freedom to discriminate, but I don't see why they would.

Re: Boy Scouts: Discrimination?

Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2012 8:00 am
by BavarianWheels
Is the BSA publically or privately funded?

Re: Boy Scouts: Discrimination?

Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2012 8:07 am
by RickD
beany wrote:
I don't see the point. I was a queer atheist scout,

Beany, that's not politically correct to say. We'll have no political un-correctness here. :pound:

Re: Boy Scouts: Discrimination?

Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2012 8:55 am
by Byblos
RickD wrote:
beany wrote:
I don't see the point. I was a queer atheist scout,

Beany, that's not politically correct to say. We'll have no political un-correctness here. :pound:


Seriously, what is up with the BSA and this stupid stance on gay people? What're they gonna do, go through a screening process to determine the level of gayness potential members have (mostly children) before admitting them? The whole thing's just so ignorant. :shakehead:

Re: Boy Scouts: Discrimination?

Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2012 8:59 am
by BavarianWheels
Byblos wrote:
RickD wrote:
beany wrote:
I don't see the point. I was a queer atheist scout,

Beany, that's not politically correct to say. We'll have no political un-correctness here. :pound:


Seriously, what is up with the BSA and this stupid stance on gay people? What're they gonna do, go through a screening process to determine the level of gayness potential members have (mostly children) before admitting them? The whole thing's just so ignorant. :shakehead:


Maybe they don't plan on doing anything other than not allowing the openly gay join...

Re: Boy Scouts: Discrimination?

Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2012 3:26 pm
by Furstentum Liechtenstein
I think BSA stance is just terrible. Just terrible. I agree that openly gay, bisexual, transsexual, NAMBLA members and respectful male porn stars should be able to participate in Boy Scouts of America's activities. Who is BSA to judge people anyway?

Shame on you, BSA!

FL

EDIT: I forgot to add cross-dressers. Why shouldn't Boy Scouts of America have cross-dressers as leaders? American boys need to accept people as they are and see the beauty in each person's soul and not stop at their outward attire. I long for the day when all sexual expressions will have equal opportunity in the great nation that is the USA!

Re: Boy Scouts: Discrimination?

Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 7:51 pm
by RickD

Re: Boy Scouts: Discrimination?

Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 8:05 pm
by RickD
I am curious, what do you think about this ban?

The ban has been upheld in court, and is perfectly legal. Whether or not we agree with the ban, isn't really the important thing. The important point is that BSA is a private organization, and by law, can decide who they want to admit, or deny admission to. I agree with private organizations being private. They or any private org should be able to decide on its own, who they want to be members.

Re: Boy Scouts: Discrimination?

Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 8:55 pm
by Beanybag
Furstentum Liechtenstein wrote:I think BSA stance is just terrible. Just terrible. I agree that openly gay, bisexual, transsexual, NAMBLA members and respectful male porn stars should be able to participate in Boy Scouts of America's activities. Who is BSA to judge people anyway?

Shame on you, BSA!

FL

EDIT: I forgot to add cross-dressers. Why shouldn't Boy Scouts of America have cross-dressers as leaders? American boys need to accept people as they are and see the beauty in each person's soul and not stop at their outward attire. I long for the day when all sexual expressions will have equal opportunity in the great nation that is the USA!


If you weren't being sarcastic, minus NAMBLA members, I'd agree with your whole post. Unfortunately, this is why Christianity tends to have a bad reputation.

And, yes, while BSA is a private organization, we also have the freedom to use our speech to criticize and pressure the scouts to change their policy.

Re: Boy Scouts: Discrimination?

Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 9:21 pm
by RickD
And, yes, while BSA is a private organization, we also have the freedom to use our speech to criticize and pressure the scouts to change their policy.

Would you also support the right of NAMBLA, to abolish the age of consent laws?

Re: Boy Scouts: Discrimination?

Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 9:25 pm
by Ivellious
They can express their opinion all they want, Rick...they have no right to act on those views because they violate some of the core laws that protect children. But just like neo-Nazis, the KKK, and other groups whose opinions are not considered "acceptable", they have a right to voice their opinions.

Re: Boy Scouts: Discrimination?

Posted: Fri Jul 20, 2012 7:51 am
by BavarianWheels
Beanybag wrote:And, yes, while BSA is a private organization, we also have the freedom to use our speech to criticize and pressure the scouts to change their policy.


Logically thinking, the time and effort placed in this freedom in speech and pressure is misplaced as the BSA is being selective well within the law.

While I may not support the overall theme of this, I do support the rights of private organizations as RickD seems to have alluded to already.

Re: Boy Scouts: Discrimination?

Posted: Sun Jul 22, 2012 4:13 pm
by Furstentum Liechtenstein
Beanybag wrote:If you weren't being sarcastic, minus NAMBLA members, I'd agree with your whole post. Unfortunately, this is why Christianity tends to have a bad reputation.


What's wrong with NAMBLA members doing volunteer work for Boy Scouts of America? NAMBLA explicitly states that love must be by mutual consent. Current social norms deny that pederasty is ''good'', but - hopefully - things will evolve into a brighter future where every sexual expression will be on an equal footing and of equal beauty. In my lifetime, I have seen the taboos of abortion, pornography, homosexuality, transsexuality, cross-dressing, bondage/sado-masochism, wife-swapping and common-law unions, fall. They've all fallen and we're much better off for it. Pederasty? it's coming...bring it on!

America! America! keep on lighting the way to a brighter future! y**==

FL