Re: Is Jesus God? And Why it Matters.

[RickD]

ok we will go with your way of thinking because apparently you do not like how I explain them... so they both apply to Jesus... and be careful not to shoot yourself in the foot thou because you are about to... just fair warning...lol....

Ok. As I was posting my last post, you posted this.

So, now that we've established that the only begotten, and the Word, both refer to Jesus Christ, do you now see John 1:1 in a different light?

nope... lol was with and was are 2 different things John 1:2 and John 17:5....

John 1:1 says that in the beginning was the Word(Jesus Christ), and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

John 1:1 is making 3 statements about the Word(Jesus Christ).

1) In the beginning was The Word

2) The Word was with God.

3) The Word was God.

We're in agreement with this, right?

[LonnieOwesn1973]

exactly I haven't disputed that Fact lol in fact I explained that fact plainly in the post we are now discussing from today...
My dispute is that Jesus was the God of Genesis...lol

Because God is immortal and cannot die and according to the Trinity, Jesus was God and died on the cross and God resurrected him...

[LonnieOwesn1973]

I mean if your Whole argument of Jesus being the God of Genesis is based on John 1:1-3 then you have no argument because you cannot explain how God can die?

The whole point of the Holy Trinity is to actually to describe the 3 Characteristics of God and applying a Personality to each one and combining eah into one God making all 3 God.. by that very statement you are saying that God can die...

[RickD]

exactly I haven't disputed that Fact lol in fact I explained that fact plainly in the post we are now discussing from today...
My dispute is that Jesus was the God of Genesis...lol

Because God is immortal and cannot die and according to the Trinity, Jesus was God and died on the cross and God resurrected him...

Ok good. I think we're having a productive conversation.


So if I understand you correctly, you agree with #3) from above " The Word(Jesus Christ)was God." But you don't think that Jesus was the God of Genesis.

Am I understanding you correctly?

[LonnieOwesn1973]

exactly I haven't disputed that Fact lol in fact I explained that fact plainly in the post we are now discussing from today...
My dispute is that Jesus was the God of Genesis...lol

Because God is immortal and cannot die and according to the Trinity, Jesus was God and died on the cross and God resurrected him...

Ok good. I think we're having a productive conversation.


So if I understand you correctly, you agree with #3) from above " The Word(Jesus Christ)was God." But you don't think that Jesus was the God of Genesis.

Am I understanding you correctly?

not at all lol....you are stating that....not me... I would never place a claim like that if there was no evidence of it at all....lol.. nice try though...

[LonnieOwesn1973]

exactly I haven't disputed that Fact lol in fact I explained that fact plainly in the post we are now discussing from today...
My dispute is that Jesus was the God of Genesis...lol

Because God is immortal and cannot die and according to the Trinity, Jesus was God and died on the cross and God resurrected him...

Ok good. I think we're having a productive conversation.


So if I understand you correctly, you agree with #3) from above " The Word(Jesus Christ)was God." But you don't think that Jesus was the God of Genesis.

Am I understanding you correctly?

he who says he wants to make no assumptions but assumes lol.....

[LonnieOwesn1973]

and Christ isn't even a name it is a title....lol...which means anointed

[RickD]

exactly I haven't disputed that Fact lol in fact I explained that fact plainly in the post we are now discussing from today...
My dispute is that Jesus was the God of Genesis...lol

Because God is immortal and cannot die and according to the Trinity, Jesus was God and died on the cross and God resurrected him...

Ok good. I think we're having a productive conversation.


So if I understand you correctly, you agree with #3) from above " The Word(Jesus Christ)was God." But you don't think that Jesus was the God of Genesis.

Am I understanding you correctly?

not at all lol....you are stating that....not me... I would never place a claim like that if there was no evidence of it at all....lol.. nice try though...

In post 287, you said we are in agreement with the 3 things that I posted in post 286. One of the 3 things says that the Word was God.

Now you're saying that you don't agree with that?

[LonnieOwesn1973]

in the context that the Word was with God I completely Agree.. but then there is that pesky John1:2 AND he was with God... and means an addition as in along side or in the same place... If it meant that the Word was Jesus then verse 2 would not be needed because it would have been established already but it wasn't and John didn't believe Jesus was God this is why he made this statement of addition... and means to add to something.

If John thought Jesus was God then John would have believed God could die...

[RickD]

in the context that the Word was with God I completely Agree.. but then there is that pesky John1:2 AND he was with God... and means an addition as in along side or in the same place... If it meant that the Word was Jesus then verse 2 would not be needed because it would have been established already but it wasn't and John didn't believe Jesus was God this is why he made this statement of addition... and means to add to something.

If John thought Jesus was God then John would have believed God could die...

You're thinking too far ahead. Let's stay focused.

Either you agree with John 1:1, or you don't. John 1:1 says that Jesus, the Word was God.

Do you agree with that statement, or not?

[LonnieOwesn1973]

nope and we are still on the same topic.. I am examining all evidence of the origin of the word and you are just cherry picking to validate your beliefs, at least that is the way it is coming across to me...
and the conclusion would be that if Jesus was the God of the Genesis then there is no way he could have died on the cross... Based on the conversation at hand... so if you can prove that God can die and not need someone else to resurrect him, please offer it.... all the same topic and pertaining to John 1:1-3
just saying...

[LonnieOwesn1973]

already been down this road many times and in the end no one can ever present proof that God can die, let alone that Jesus was God...

[RickD]

nope and we are still on the same topic.. I am examining all evidence of the origin of the word and you are just cherry picking to validate your beliefs, at least that is the way it is coming across to me...
and the conclusion would be that if Jesus was the God of the Genesis then there is no way he could have died on the cross... Based on the conversation at hand... so if you can prove that God can die and not need someone else to resurrect him, please offer it.... all the same topic and pertaining to John 1:1-3
just saying...

Cherry picking to validate my beliefs?

We literally started with John 1:1. And we worked through the verse to see what it actually says. And you disagree with what it actually says, "the Word was God."

I can't have a conversation with you, if you go off on rabbit trails, and refuse to stay focused. And now, you disagree with scripture.

I don't have time for this anymore today. I thought we were actually getting somewhere. But when the truth hit you, you just brushed it aside, and pretended like you never read it.

You are extremely dishonest. You really need to think about why you are here. You refuse to see what is plainly in front of you.

[LonnieOwesn1973]

nope and we are still on the same topic.. I am examining all evidence of the origin of the word and you are just cherry picking to validate your beliefs, at least that is the way it is coming across to me...
and the conclusion would be that if Jesus was the God of the Genesis then there is no way he could have died on the cross... Based on the conversation at hand... so if you can prove that God can die and not need someone else to resurrect him, please offer it.... all the same topic and pertaining to John 1:1-3
just saying...

Cherry picking to validate my beliefs?

We literally started with John 1:1. And we worked through the verse to see what it actually says. And you disagree with what it actually says, "the Word was God."

I can't have a conversation with you, if you go off on rabbit trails, and refuse to stay focused. And now, you disagree with scripture.

I don't have time for this anymore today. I thought we were actually getting somewhere. But when the truth hit you, you just brushed it aside, and pretended like you never read it.

You are extremely dishonest. You really need to think about why you are here. You refuse to see what is plainly in front of you.

I honestly Thought we were getting somewhere as well ... do you believe God can die???...
I mean it is ok to disrespect me but it is not ok to return the favor???....

I mean can you, honestly, in your heart of hearts, believe that God can die?

[LonnieOwesn1973]

since RickD doesn't believe that God can Die...

Anyone else out there who believes in the Holy Trinity.... Do you believe that God can die?