Yes, I'm bowing out as I see it as pointless argument.RickD wrote:My point is that ACB does not understand evolution. He's making an argument against something he doesn't understand.mel wrote:
And this is the exact reason Abel keeps going on about it because he feels like he needs to defend it, is it any wonder?......
You are using Rick the dictionaries secondary definition of evolution. We all know what it means for Petes sake. As clearly defined by dictionary and culture.
So, you're going to assert that the gap theory is totally reconcilable with scripture and science. And then to back your assertion, you are going to bow out?I'm not going to get into a debate about this so I'm bowing out, by the Gap Theory is totally reconcilable with science and scripture. That is how I interpreted scripture personally long before I even knew it was a theory, so it must be right
I was told from the get go, ohh it's wrong, nobody believes that anymore
Well, you know what they say about things asserted without evidence, being dismissed without evidence...
Really? So now, disagreeing with a creation stance, showing why we disagree with it, is wrong?Perhaps if there was more respect across the board for people's creation stances we wouldn't look like arguing, spoilt, school yard children to observers.
Sure. That's how I look at it. I don't question someone's intelligence, or honesty, or even scriptural understanding, until I think there's a reason to question one of them. And just because I disagree with someone's scriptural understanding, and show reasons why I disagree, that doesn't necessarily mean I question their integrity. It's about having a discussion. I think X is correct because...you think y is correct because...What I said about respecting people's creation stances was not directed at you Rick but an overall statement. There have been posters on here that have felt this who are YEC.
Can't we just disagree without making it personal, questioning people's intelligence, integrity, scriptural understanding ect.
We all just trying to do the best we can with the info we have. Non Christians included.
Then we hopefully take it all into consideration when we decide what we want to believe.
The contradictions and ironies on all accounts in regards to this topic lead me in the opposite direction.
And to be completely honest, I don't care to participate...
Not that I hold zero interest in the topic but I care neither to influence another nor be swayed by the means or mechanisms used in 'these' types of threads. They are not beneficial as I far as I see it, and lead to the same outcome.
A squabble over highly subjective biblical text that can be utilised and interpreted to suit ones desire.
We stand on our perceived idea of 'truth' and swing our axe to grind against those that view differently. It can be done as stated as a means to consider thoughtfully creation positions but personally I don't believe it's a means to do so nor to I believe it's particularly thoughtful inregards to any kind of reconciliation of beliefs.
As I said in my previous post it disintegrates too rapidly into a schoolyard scenario of insults. By and large of the 'Christian' persuasion. You don't understand scripture, you are mis interpreting scripture, you are ignoring scripture yadda yadda insult.
Because at the very end of the day when it comes to theology and Christianity we can package as thoughtfully as we like but we are talking about the understanding and interpretation of biblical text.
Period.
With so many divisions within the camp not just with creation it all boils down to the same thing every time, the ultimate slander, flung around by every christian to defend their position.
You are misinterpreting, misunderstanding scripture.
Whilst the greatest scholars, theologians and intellects of past and present accuse each other of the same.
All cloaked under the premise that it's an honest pursuit for truth.
All the while as we slander, belittle, mock, ridicule, and do what we do best..... Argue and debate for the utopia of 'truth'.
That is what I'm not interested in.
That I want no part of.
And that I bow out of without apology or excuse.
Sure I have a personal belief on creation but I'm not going to get into a cat fight or dog fight over it because well truth be known I'm not that blasted sure. I'm not so sure how anybody is.
It's an educated guess. A flawed understanding.
YEC's say how the use of yom is stretched quite considerably for progressive creationists and TE's . It's a non biblical far strectched interpretation of the word. Study of Hebrew does considerably show that this word is to be taken linguistically on its literal interpretation.
But of course which I quite agree with perhaps with the difficulty of translation and words having several applications possibility arises for differing interpretations.
Then when meanings and applications of Hebrew words as 'asah' or 'bara' are questioned those same individuals who quite readily utilise a somewhat to many questionable translation of Hebrew text to reach their own personal belief system then use the exact same refutations against others.
That is where it gets very convoluted and ambigious to me.
Not in understanding, I welcome that but in the slandering department.
On a final note Rick, my previous post should not have been directly quoted to you.
I never meant it personally to you, whatsoever.
But an overall assumption across the board.
Peace and love
