Kiwi Cult or Christian Community?

[Nessa]

This documentary is currently running on one of our tv channels.

Just wondered what you guys think?



But in our defense, at least no one is actually claiming to be "Jesus"

[crochet1949]

Some feed-back about the 1st video -- they appear to be okay -- but they do have 'uniforms' as such for the women. And the kids. In a way -- it's a dress-code. It's very unusual , but really there's nothing Wrong with it. Communal living Can work if the people involved believe in it -- and if people are free to leave when they want to. As long as people are not Forced to be there, if they are allowed to mingle with the 'outside' world. But Biblically -- we Are to be with the 'world' in order To share the Gospel unto salvation. The goal of a Christian community Should be to 'grow' the community of believers. Not to Isolate in order to protect the up-coming generation. A church is made up of believers who use their skills to build up the church family -- but -- As believers -- we are to share when appropriate that which Bible teaches. Living lives that attract people To Christ and not driving them Away From.

The send one is Wrong. Totally. Anyone claiming to Be the Messiah -- is Wrong. His eyes have a 'look'.

This world is So far away from Biblical / New Testament ways of doing things.

[Nessa]

You bring up some really good points, Crochet.

Yes A.J does have a 'look". I could see him quite calmly killing someone in "the name of the father' and then saying grace and sitting down for lunch

Although Glorivale may be misled in some areas, I think they still have alot to teach us. Though I dont see anything wrong with some of todays fashions.

[Nessa]

Have just watched more of the Glorivale series...

One of the girls said that if her husband to be left the place or vise versa, the other would not leave too.
Leaving the place indicates the person is not fully submitted to God... okay, thats more than a little disturbing...
though when you try to leave some churches you can get that sorta vibe too....

It's normal for older women to marry younger guys (woohoo lol kidding)
And also when they date they have chaperones. Now I kinda like this idea.
Some people would say this is a bit over the top but really, I kind of think there is some merit to it.

[Nessa]

Approx 500 ppl live in this secluded community down South.

Brides wear 'pink' not white cos they don't need to prove their virginity when alot of brides wear white and aren't virgins...

No one has money - all goes to the good of the community..

The single women and men don't mix. Forming any kind of relationship/friendship just gets "messy".

And the divorce rate is 0
The women are in full submission to their husbands and often you don't meet and talk to your husband to be until you get engaged.
Arranged marriage type of thing.

[crochet1949]

Nessa -- was just reading your comments -- another question would be 'where do these people come From'? I don't think it's a natural setting for meeting people -- new friends -- it would be a very controlled social setting. Then again -- lots of young people grow up in the same church and date and marry. Or they grow up in the same schools and get together.

Having chaperones is good in theory. I'd be more for doing things in groups -- but eventually, young people are going to naturally want to be alone to simply talk and get away From the crowd. If they Didn't - the parents would have reason to wonder. And that's where it's the parents job to talk to their young people and morals -- the importance of sexual purity before marriage. Wise parents will have their home available for weekend group activities --Their controlled / yet fun environment. Was just thinking -- the 'chaperoning' Could simply be in the form of parents going out with their kids / friends. Doing fun things together. We have only One chance to raise / get to know our kids as they grow up.

So many times the idea is that parents are supposed to show they care for their teens by supplying them with condoms or birth control pills -- because, after all, 'kids will be kids'. But That is sending them the Wrong message. In stead of instilling them with a sense of personal responsibility // that sex , physical intimacy Does have a price. Their self-respect for one thing, as well as possible diseases that would be passed along. And those unexpected babies. All those innocent babies who are 'disposed of' because of their inconvenient timing for coming along. But it Does take Two people to start the process.

[Nessa]

Nessa -- was just reading your comments -- another question would be 'where do these people come From'? I don't think it's a natural setting for meeting people -- new friends -- it would be a very controlled social setting. Then again -- lots of young people grow up in the same church and date and marry. Or they grow up in the same schools and get together.

Having chaperones is good in theory. I'd be more for doing things in groups -- but eventually, young people are going to naturally want to be alone to simply talk and get away From the crowd. If they Didn't - the parents would have reason to wonder. And that's where it's the parents job to talk to their young people and morals -- the importance of sexual purity before marriage. Wise parents will have their home available for weekend group activities --Their controlled / yet fun environment. Was just thinking -- the 'chaperoning' Could simply be in the form of parents going out with their kids / friends. Doing fun things together. We have only One chance to raise / get to know our kids as they grow up.

So many times the idea is that parents are supposed to show they care for their teens by supplying them with condoms or birth control pills -- because, after all, 'kids will be kids'. But That is sending them the Wrong message. In stead of instilling them with a sense of personal responsibility // that sex , physical intimacy Does have a price. Their self-respect for one thing, as well as possible diseases that would be passed along. And those unexpected babies. All those innocent babies who are 'disposed of' because of their inconvenient timing for coming along. But it Does take Two people to start the process.

I think most are born into the community but it mentioned that not all were. Not sure how that works. They do have outsiders come in regards to a huge concert that they hold. You see the people in the community talking to people from different places.

One girl in the community mentioned that she had talked to a little girl who was from another place and how the girls parents had split up. The little girl said her world was turned upside down. Now I don't think that is a great reason to advocate living in a cut off community but it does raise questions bout what really is the right response to our high divorce rate and adultery issues.

But then is this ALL just surface stuff that is in these documentaries? I can't help wondering what the real unedited story is.

We are all human and sin and theres no way that that does not happen in this place. That is the side I am not seeing. I am not seeing anyone own up to have having premarital sex or being unfaithful... stuff like that. Even if it's a rare occurrence.. surely it happens.

I guess I just wonder what the whole truth is.

[crochet1949]

Approx 500 ppl live in this secluded community down South.

Brides wear 'pink' not white cos they don't need to prove their virginity when alot of brides wear white and aren't virgins...

No one has money - all goes to the good of the community..

The single women and men don't mix. Forming any kind of relationship/friendship just gets "messy".

And the divorce rate is 0
The women are in full submission to their husbands and often you don't meet and talk to your husband to be until you get engaged.
Arranged marriage type of thing.

Some of what you're sharing is Not good. The idea of no people having their own money -- it all going to the 'good of the community'. Which means that No One Can Leave. They don't learn personal money management.

To Some Extent -- other people Can see how people relate to each other and sort of do some 'match making'. But freedom of choice is a Good thing. Of Course, the divorce rate would be zero -- who's going to say No to 'pappa' or whomever is making the engagement decisions and where would they go when they Did divorce. And when the women are taught to submit to hubby , they Do so.

Relationships are Bound to get 'messy'. That's part of life.

In a population of 500 people -- there Might be some determined young people who find a way to 'do it' regardless. But, then again, from that video -- it all looks mighty regimented / organized. When kids are raised that way -- are never in the 'normal' world, they don't know any different and are cooperative.

Just remembered that God told people to spread out over the land and multiply. And He Also wanted families to stay within their religious practices. And I've Also heard that Lots of countries practices arranged marriages. Maybe we simply need to take marriage a whole lot more seriously.

[Nessa]

Okay, now we may be getting somewhere..

bloody aussie leader

[crochet1949]

Divorce Does turn a person's life / world up-side-down.

High divorce and adultery rate. Possibly getting married too young. When a marriage isn't very happy, having a side-relationship is tried. That CAN result in 'crimes of passion'. People get married for dumb reasons / lots of chemistry but not much else. They get bored / baby enters picture and complicates life. Marriage is Work. People stay married, Until someone more interesting comes along. It's treated more 'going steady' and breaking up.

[Nessa]

omgosh

this leader doesn't see anything necessarily wrong with a 12year old having sex...
Parents having sex infront of kids...
Sex education was from seeing parents have sex

and this leader"s latest wife was 17 .. he being in his 60's
Also been accused of molestrating his son.. sheese..


The leader has fathered 20 children.. quarter of the community is related to him

[Nessa]

Also quite a few of other accounts of molestation

[Nessa]

He was sentenced to jail time for it

[Nessa]

oh and your salvation is dependent on being in the community..

[RickD]

Seems to me that the group twists scripture to lord it over the women in the group. Especially the leader.

Disgusting if you ask me.

My wife is perfectly happy on rare occasions that I release her from her basement chains, and allow her free roam of the entire kitchen. If she complains, I'll just show her these videos. That'll straiten her out real quick.