Christian Science vs. Christ's deity

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Re: Christian Science vs. Christ's deity

Postby RickD » Tue Feb 04, 2014 4:22 pm

Furstentum Liechtenstein wrote:
Danieltwotwenty wrote:I really have not seen much good fruit around here lately.


Because we've been getting a lot of :fruitcake: lately.

Anyway, Ann won't be back.

FL

Daniel said she was driven away by her chauffeur.
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Re: Christian Science vs. Christ's deity

Postby RickD » Tue Feb 04, 2014 4:25 pm

Ann is still welcome here. She seems like a very nice lady. y@};-
1 Corinthians 1:9
9 God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

Audie wrote:
"Christianity is not a joke, but it has some very poor representatives."


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Re: Christian Science vs. Christ's deity

Postby Danieltwotwenty » Tue Feb 04, 2014 5:29 pm

Furstentum Liechtenstein wrote:
Danieltwotwenty wrote:I really have not seen much good fruit around here lately.


Because we've been getting a lot of :fruitcake: lately.

Anyway, Ann won't be back.

FL


This is the type of bad fruit I was talking about.

If Ann won't be back it will be because of these types of comments coming from yourself and others.
1Tim1:15-17
Here is a trustworthy saying that deserves full acceptance: Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners of whom I am the worst. But for that very reason I was shown mercy so that in me, the worst of sinners, Christ Jesus might display his immense patience as an example for those who would believe in him and receive eternal life. Now to the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only God, be honor and glory for ever and ever.Amen.

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Re: Christian Science vs. Christ's deity

Postby Furstentum Liechtenstein » Tue Feb 04, 2014 6:16 pm

Danieltwotwenty wrote:This is the type of bad fruit I was talking about.If Ann won't be back it will be because of these types of comments coming from yourself and others.


Nope. Ann won't be back because cultists can't have fellowship with Christians.

What surprised me most about this whole thing was your behavior. Politeness is admirable but why did you insist she be considered Christian?

FL
Hold everything lightly. If you don't, it will hurt when God pries your fingers loose as He takes it from you. -Corrie Ten Boom

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Re: Christian Science vs. Christ's deity

Postby B. W. » Tue Feb 04, 2014 7:02 pm

The basic premise of Christian Science is manipulating God to bend to human will.

It was developed during the era when the concept of the "Power of the Will" or 'New Thought Metaphysics' was in vogue amongst spiritualist and transferred over into a Christianized version.

Mary Baker Eddy's apparent mentor/teacher was Phineas Quimby who is the founder of New Thought Metaphysics. There you have a direct link to the occult practice of the power of the will.

Should we say more?

Mat 12:33

...and 2 Co 6:14 says it best...
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Re: Christian Science vs. Christ's deity

Postby Danieltwotwenty » Tue Feb 04, 2014 7:27 pm

Furstentum Liechtenstein wrote: Politeness is admirable but why did you insist she be considered Christian?


Because that is what she claimed to be and I was hoping to talk a bit about how she viewed Christ, all you guys started telling her what she believes instead of actually asking her and pretty much insulted her.

Just because she does not quite understand Christs deity does not mean she wasn't a Christian, even the early churches at the beginning debated this at great length , would you say they weren't Christians either?

I think the behavior here has been deplorable lately.
Last edited by Danieltwotwenty on Tue Feb 04, 2014 7:40 pm, edited 2 times in total.
1Tim1:15-17
Here is a trustworthy saying that deserves full acceptance: Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners of whom I am the worst. But for that very reason I was shown mercy so that in me, the worst of sinners, Christ Jesus might display his immense patience as an example for those who would believe in him and receive eternal life. Now to the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only God, be honor and glory for ever and ever.Amen.

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Re: Christian Science vs. Christ's deity

Postby Kurieuo » Tue Feb 04, 2014 7:29 pm

People need to take responsibility for their own beliefs and actions.

At judgement, God won't ask non-Christians "who turned you away from me." Rather I think God will ask an account from them "why did you deny and hide from me?"

It's not the role of a Christian to convert, but rather shine truth in what ever personality or style God has given them. People receive and hear truth in different ways.

With that said, let's not forget Jesus' words to his disciples in Matthew 10:16: "Behold, I send you out as sheep in the midst of wolves; so be shrewd as serpents and innocent as doves."

Let's not squabble amongst ourselves, especially over issues of political correctness. y:-&
"Whoever will call on the name of the Lord will be saved." (Romans 10:13)

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Re: Christian Science vs. Christ's deity

Postby B. W. » Tue Feb 04, 2014 7:48 pm

Kurieuo wrote:People need to take responsibility for their own beliefs and actions.

At judgement, God won't ask non-Christians "who turned you away from me." Rather I think God will ask an account from them "why did you deny and hide from me?"

It's not the role of a Christian to convert, but rather shine truth in what ever personality or style God has given them. People receive and hear truth in different ways.

With that said, let's not forget Jesus' words to his disciples in Matthew 10:16: "Behold, I send you out as sheep in the midst of wolves; so be shrewd as serpents and innocent as doves."

Let's not squabble amongst ourselves, especially over issues of political correctness. y:-&


I know God is sovereign and trust in that, therefore, whoever Ann is or was, was here by divine plan, and what was said to her was as well, all for a purpose beyond what I can fully fathom.

We can learn from mistakes as well as make an impact upon a cultist in a forceful way as well. Trust in God and obey and leave the consequences to Him as He is sovereign...

What was said maybe will be the catalyst the Lord uses later on to save a wayward soul... :amen:
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Re: Christian Science vs. Christ's deity

Postby Furstentum Liechtenstein » Tue Feb 04, 2014 7:51 pm

Danieltwotwenty wrote:Just because she does not quite understand Christs deity does not mean she wasn't a Christian, even the early churches debated this at great length in the beginning, would you say they weren't Christians either?


The difference between a cult and a Christian is that a cult worships a demon. Not one of the cults' Jesuses are the God of the Bible. Moreover, all cults use the Bible in a secondary or tertiary teaching role, and it is always discredited in some way. The primary text of a cult is some other holy book. This is true for Christian Science, Mormonism, Jehovah's Witnesses, the Unification Church, Islam, Black Islam (Nation of Islam), Baha'i, and so on.

Christians - be they ignorant or knowledgeable - have only the Bible as a sacred text. If someone claims some other teaching, beware.

B. W. wrote:What was said maybe will be the catalyst the Lord uses later on to save a wayward soul... :amen:


FL :amen:
Hold everything lightly. If you don't, it will hurt when God pries your fingers loose as He takes it from you. -Corrie Ten Boom

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If they had a social gospel in the days of the prodigal son, somebody would have given him a bed and a sandwich and he never would have gone home.

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Re: Christian Science vs. Christ's deity

Postby RickD » Tue Feb 04, 2014 7:54 pm

Daniel wrote:
Because that is what she claimed to be and I was hoping to talk a bit about how she viewed Christ, all you guys started telling her what she believes instead of actually asking her and pretty much insulted her.

If you go back and read the thread, you'll see I asked her to give her beliefs here when I said:
Since you think the websites that were posted are inaccurate, perhaps we could hear it from you. Who do you say Jesus Christ is? Do you believe He is God in the flesh?


ChristianScientistAnn also said she agrees with one website I linked. It's christianscience.com:
ChristianScienceAnn wrote:
I have looked at all the sites mentioned above that are supposed to explain Christian Science, and find them all to be inaccurate except, of course, http://www.christianscience.com, which is our church website. 2 John 7 - 11 doesn't apply. We can "agree to disagree" though, I hope. There's enough room in the universe, right?


So, we gave her a chance to join the discussion. She was invited to explain what she believes. Instead, she chose to defer to the CS website. So contrary to what you're saying Daniel, nobody is telling her what she believes. Perhaps she believes differently than the CS website on something. She has the opportunity to respond if she wants. She was on earlier this evening, reading the thread, and chose not to respond.

Daniel wrote:
Just because she does not quite understand Christs deity does not mean she wasn't a Christian, even the early churches at the beginning debated this at great length , would you say they weren't Christians either?

Just for the record, I never said she wasn't a Christian. I don't know if she ever trusted Christ(the biblical Christ) for salvation. All we know is that she's choosing not to respond, and she said she agrees with the CS website.

Again, she is welcome here. Nobody told her to leave.

But I tell you this Daniel, if I join a watchtower forum for example, and my screen name is TrinitarianRick, I'd be willing to talk about my beliefs.
1 Corinthians 1:9
9 God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

Audie wrote:
"Christianity is not a joke, but it has some very poor representatives."


St. Richard the Sarcastic--The Patron Saint of Irony

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Re: Christian Science vs. Christ's deity

Postby neo-x » Tue Feb 04, 2014 11:22 pm

I think Daniel is saying that we chould have welcomed her to speak up first, and should not have rushed her about discussing her beliefs right away in the first thread she ever posted on g&s... May be we could have had some fruitful discussion. I don't think that is a bad idea.

I remember her line, "there is enough space for all of us" or close to it. Imagine what it was for her, just like we think she is lost, her beliefs would entail we were wrong and yet she came here first and was friendly and was willing to leave things at that.

Personally I doubt she would have stayed either way but I could be wrong. Whether shes ever believed Christ or not is between her and God.
People treat facts as relevant more when the facts tend to support their opinions. When the facts are against their opinions, they don't necessarily deny the facts, but they say the facts are less relevant or insignificant. This is ofcourse because believing things that make you feel comfortable, takes a priority. And I think that should not be the case if one is after truth.

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Re: Christian Science vs. Christ's deity

Postby 1over137 » Tue Feb 04, 2014 11:26 pm

Ann, still may be reading what we say, so why not showing what Bible says on Christ here?
But examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good.
-- 1 Thessalonians 5:21

For I am confident of this very thing, that He who began a good work in you will perfect it until the day of Christ Jesus.
-- Philippians 1:6

The LORD is my rock and my fortress and my deliverer, My God, my rock, in whom I take refuge; My shield and the horn of my salvation, my stronghold
-- Psalm 18:2

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Re: Christian Science vs. Christ's deity

Postby RickD » Wed Feb 05, 2014 3:55 am

neo-x wrote:I think Daniel is saying that we chould have welcomed her to speak up first, and should not have rushed her about discussing her beliefs right away in the first thread she ever posted on g&s... May be we could have had some fruitful discussion. I don't think that is a bad idea.

I remember her line, "there is enough space for all of us" or close to it. Imagine what it was for her, just like we think she is lost, her beliefs would entail we were wrong and yet she came here first and was friendly and was willing to leave things at that.

Personally I doubt she would have stayed either way but I could be wrong. Whether shes ever believed Christ or not is between her and God.

Neo, if she's knowledgeable about Christian Science, she had to know the backlash she'd receive, if she joined a Christian forum, while using a screen name of ChristianScientistAnn. Anyone who has openly been a Christian Scientist in this country, for any length of time, knows that Christians think it's a cult. If she just wanted to join the forum and be friendly, without all the Christian Science discussion, she could've chosen a less controversial screen name.
1 Corinthians 1:9
9 God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

Audie wrote:
"Christianity is not a joke, but it has some very poor representatives."


St. Richard the Sarcastic--The Patron Saint of Irony

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Re: Christian Science vs. Christ's deity

Postby 1over137 » Wed Feb 05, 2014 4:19 am

If she was seriously interested to be here then the choice of her username was not a happy one.

edit: if she wishes I can change it.
But examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good.
-- 1 Thessalonians 5:21

For I am confident of this very thing, that He who began a good work in you will perfect it until the day of Christ Jesus.
-- Philippians 1:6

The LORD is my rock and my fortress and my deliverer, My God, my rock, in whom I take refuge; My shield and the horn of my salvation, my stronghold
-- Psalm 18:2

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Re: Christian Science vs. Christ's deity

Postby ChristianScientistAnn » Wed Feb 05, 2014 12:24 pm

Hello, I’ve read all the pages in the original thread and this new thread as well.
I enjoyed the funny liar youtube video and the fruitcake and the chauffeur as well. Good laughs. But I’m committed to Christian Science, folks. I love Christian Science. There hasn’t been even one remark made in the thread that I haven’t already heard many many times. None have surprised me or disturbed me.
I like my username because it brings attention to my religion, if anyone were to be truly interested in learning about it. My username is helpful to me and everyone else online here, because my remarks are understood within that context. That’s the way it’s done at in-person ecumenical meetings which I much prefer to this. Here, I could be talking to Pope Francis for all I know! It feels like talking in the dark. Does the Pope like Bacon Marmalade would be my first question…
Why have I returned? I’m here to be polite and to bring the issue of this thread to a close.
My motives for joining this online site were to encourage atheists towards Christianity (whatever you may think of my brand of Christianity), to answer sincere questions about Christian Science, and to see what religious folks are discussing online. I am not at all interested in being part of a discussion that is aimed at trying to change my religion. I assume it’s that way with you too. Aren’t you committed too?
I am certainly able to hold my own in this type of wild ride, but I don’t have the time. I also would no doubt find it very, very heavy to be misunderstood all the time, if I were to continue with this discussion. We all have tradeoffs to consider. If I were to take the time to debate Christian Science at length with you, I wouldn’t have the time to pray for someone else who has asked me to pray for them, and the world needs our prayers more than it needs this kind of debate between believers. Syria, Thailand, Ukraine, Egypt, etc.
I am certainly able to hold my own in this kind of discussion. Others? Hmmm. I don’t think so.
If any of you were to visit a Christian Science Reading Room or the Church of Christ, Scientist near you and mention which religion you are, no one would be trying to convert you or change your view or warn you that you are on the wrong path etc. You would be free to keep your religion without criticism. We would welcome you, and be available if you had a question. We would not say a word against your religion. Our way with a visitor is to assume that they know what they want and to let them be. Not different than a shopping excursion. A salesperson stands by but understands that some just want to browse, and some want to buy. The question is what are you selling…Comedy and what else…
Well, enjoy the debate about “Christian Science vs. Christ’s deity” without me. Our church website is good, if you are looking for information.
Unless I get kicked out, I’ll be back and glad to communicate with any of you, but not to participate in this thread. There are a multitude of things we do disagree on but The Lord’s Prayer is our point of agreement and that’s where I’ll end this, agreeing on that. In peace, Ann


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