Self Gratification

Discussion for Christian perspectives on ethical issues such as abortion, euthanasia, sexuality, and so forth.
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Unsure1
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Self Gratification

Postby Unsure1 » Fri Nov 18, 2016 11:10 am

I am trying to determine if masturbation is truly a sin, or not. There is no mention of it in the bible, and I get conflicting answers from the Internet.

If a person is abstinent, is masturbation wrong?

What are your thoughts?

Thanks,

Unsure1

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Re: Self Gratification

Postby RickD » Fri Nov 18, 2016 11:14 am

Are you lusting after women while masturbating?

Lust is a sin.
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Unsure1
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Re: Self Gratification

Postby Unsure1 » Fri Nov 18, 2016 12:22 pm

This is my concern.

If lust is a sin, and people lust all the time, even while sitting at their desk working, then I would assume that masturbation is no worse than that, right? (If one were lusting about another at the time)

This is a question that I have been pondering for some time.

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Re: Self Gratification

Postby RickD » Fri Nov 18, 2016 12:48 pm

If you're looking for me to justify lust being ok, I won't do it.

Lust is wrong.

Your asking if lust in one instance is worse than lust in another instance, is like asking if murder is any less of a sin, depending on the circumstance.
1 Corinthians 1:9
9 God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

Audie wrote:
"Christianity is not a joke, but it has some very poor representatives."


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Unsure1
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Re: Self Gratification

Postby Unsure1 » Fri Nov 18, 2016 1:47 pm

No, I actually wasn't asking either of those questions, but your response answered my question.

A sin is a sin.

So, if one is not lusting while masturbating, then it is not considered a sin?

That makes sense

Thanks

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Re: Self Gratification

Postby Nessa » Fri Nov 18, 2016 3:55 pm

Unsure1 wrote:No, I actually wasn't asking either of those questions, but your response answered my question.

A sin is a sin.

So, if one is not lusting while masturbating, then it is not considered a sin?

That makes sense

Thanks


Personally, I dont think it necessarily is a sin but I think it can be a sin. Alot of it depends what/who you are thinking about when you are doing the deed alone. Which brings in the lust issue.

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Re: Self Gratification

Postby RickD » Fri Nov 18, 2016 4:09 pm

Nessa wrote:
Unsure1 wrote:No, I actually wasn't asking either of those questions, but your response answered my question.

A sin is a sin.

So, if one is not lusting while masturbating, then it is not considered a sin?

That makes sense

Thanks


Personally, I dont think it necessarily is a sin but I think it can be a sin. Alot of it depends what/who you are thinking about when you are doing the deed alone. Which brings in the lust issue.

That's basically what I'm saying as well. Good point Miss Vanessa. :D
1 Corinthians 1:9
9 God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

Audie wrote:
"Christianity is not a joke, but it has some very poor representatives."


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Re: Self Gratification

Postby Nessa » Fri Nov 18, 2016 5:07 pm

The question some would ask is the act of masturbation lustful itself?

And in another thread while ago, it was pointed out not all lust is bad.

Though I always thought it was but was challenged.

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Re: Self Gratification

Postby melanie » Sat Nov 19, 2016 9:25 am

Unsure1 wrote:I am trying to determine if masturbation is truly a sin, or not. There is no mention of it in the bible, and I get conflicting answers from the Internet.

If a person is abstinent, is masturbation wrong?

What are your thoughts?

Thanks,

Unsure1


Firstly the Internet is probably not the best place for answers in regards to spirituality and any finality on sin and what equates to such. Perhaps at best food for thought.

Masturbation is not a sin
It is a physiological, human response to hormones and stimuli.
Anyone that has parented young ones and teenagers, not withstanding our own experiences across the years knows that personal sexual exploration is part of the human experience.
It starts from a very young age, as every male experiences the morning wake up call. This progresses in puberty to wet dreams, unexpected 'moments', long showers and masturbation. No one should ever feel dirty, wrong or sinful for experiencing exactly what nature and God intended.
I'm speaking generally in regards to boys but I think it's important to maintain that girls also are sexual and experience normal and natural personal exploration.
Masturbation is not wrong or dirty.
Let's not turn what is a very normal and important progression of every young person into something shameful.
It's not.
Lust can be damaging, in many regards. When it takes focus away from God and family but most often it's just a necessary physiological action.
We live in such an overly sexualised environment which I believe has warped our thinking. With an over abundance of inappropriate stimuli, we view the solitary sexual act as a result of something negative and sinful. Which it can be but more importantly it is also a very natural expression of the human condition. Unfortunately we live in a time when the line is very blurred as to when that crosses over to inappropriate lustfulness due to the nature of society. Half naked men and women splashed over every advertisement, advert sexualisation and in your face nudity.... so where does a person draw the line between what is inappropriate and just your natural, normal sexual experience of the individual?
It's a matter between us and God.
Masturbation in of itself is not a sin.
If we fall short and lustfulness is a struggle then God will do what He does best and deal with us in the loving, Fatherly way that He treats His own.

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Re: Self Gratification

Postby Philip » Sat Nov 19, 2016 1:45 pm

Masturbation becomes sin when one lusts for someone other than their spouse while doing it. Sexually thinking of or looking at images of one who is not yours is lusting for something not lawful for you. Masturbation CAN be a good thing - it can be done by single people not thinking of another person or imagery, but only concentrating upon the sensations - what is good about that? How about RELIEF of pent-up, raging hormones and physical desire. Unsatisfied, for those with a strong sex drive, it can be all consuming. M can bring relief, if temporarily. If one spouse is, for some period, unavailable, M can provide relief. It is only lust when done thinking or looking at imagery of another who is not your spouse. Cannot one spouse M the other? Of course! So, it CAN be done without lusting. However, one must guard their heart, mind and eyes in this. Habitual M - that shows one obsessed with a controlling behavior.

As for those insisting ALL M is sinful and lustful - what happens is, kids especially, often have enormously strong sex drives. And most have EQUATED M with looking at images online, etc. and porn to facilitate their M - which is sinful and lustful. So, while they COULD get sexual tension relief without lusting, by ONLY concentrating upon the pleasurable sensations, instead, they've never even considered that they could obtain the relief without lusting. But their drive is often VERY powerful. So single Christians try not to at M at ALL - typically, only to incur failure after failure, which creates enormous guilt. This should not be the case: A) They shouldn't lust to porn or images (whether physical or mental), and B) they also shouldn't unnecessarily have to suffer with pent up sexual desire that COULD be UNsinfully alleviated without also lusting. So, it's not an either/or - and yet, that is what most Christians have been taught, growing up. Any sin of M is all in the LUSTING, it's not in the act!

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Re: Self Gratification

Postby Kurieuo » Sun Nov 20, 2016 6:34 pm

We're biological, with that territory comes many physical challenges that we can rise above to embrace more spiritually wholesome values.

In our bodies we lust for things that aren't necessarily "spiritually wholesome". Yet self-control over our animalistic nature is seen as a respectable human virtue. There are a whole list of spiritual qualities we can strive to achieve to be better within ourselves.

Equally we can get so carried away seeking to become spiritually wholesome and morally upright, that the focus upon such self-improvement ironically becomes a selfish self-love. It can result in a spiritual vanity and pride that leaves behind a more important love for others. I'd much rather be impure trying to love others, than "perfect" within myself with a love that is covered by a thick veneer of self-righteousness.

Understand, that there is none righteous, not even one. All have sinned and fall short of God. That is, all except the One in whom we hope for redemption. His yoke is light, and was about loving God and loving others -- not what we should or shouldn't do which, while good to know, we fail miserably at and thankfully His life atoned for.
"Whoever will call on the name of the Lord will be saved." (Romans 10:13)

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Re: Self Gratification

Postby RickD » Mon Nov 21, 2016 3:17 pm

Kurieuo wrote:We're biological, with that territory comes many physical challenges that we can rise above to embrace more spiritually wholesome values.

In our bodies we lust for things that aren't necessarily "spiritually wholesome". Yet self-control over our animalistic nature is seen as a respectable human virtue. There are a whole list of spiritual qualities we can strive to achieve to be better within ourselves.

Equally we can get so carried away seeking to become spiritually wholesome and morally upright, that the focus upon such self-improvement ironically becomes a selfish self-love. It can result in a spiritual vanity and pride that leaves behind a more important love for others. I'd much rather be impure trying to love others, than "perfect" within myself with a love that is covered by a thick veneer of self-righteousness.

Understand, that there is none righteous, not even one. All have sinned and fall short of God. That is, all except the One in whom we hope for redemption. His yoke is light, and was about loving God and loving others -- not what we should or shouldn't do which, while good to know, we fail miserably at and thankfully His life atoned for.

No. yur wrong. You no shew wurks you no saved. You shew wurks too pruv your saved, to uhvoid Parricide.
1 Corinthians 1:9
9 God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

Audie wrote:
"Christianity is not a joke, but it has some very poor representatives."


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Re: Self Gratification

Postby Philip » Mon Nov 21, 2016 3:51 pm

K: In our bodies we lust for things that aren't necessarily "spiritually wholesome". Yet self-control over our animalistic nature is seen as a respectable human virtue. There are a whole list of spiritual qualities we can strive to achieve to be better within ourselves.


While true that we can lust for a wide variety of sinful sexual things (adulterous thoughts, desires, etc.), one's NATURAL (see, GOD-given) sexual urges should not be equated with sin. It is HOW one thinks about and enacts that drive. That drive pre-exists before one even has a spouse - and for those who NEVER have a spouse. And it is God Who gave us this drive and the associated nerve endings. Interesting, isn't it, that all manner of sexual sins are detailed in Scripture, as they are also equated with sinful desires and activities, and yet, M isn't one of them???!!! But the principles of how even that can play out sinfully - or play out NOT so - still have Scriptural principles that apply.

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Re: Self Gratification

Postby Nessa » Mon Nov 21, 2016 4:04 pm

Well if your right hand causes you to sin... ;) :P :lol:

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Re: Self Gratification

Postby RickD » Mon Nov 21, 2016 4:14 pm

Nessa wrote:Well if your right hand causes you to sin... ;) :P :lol:

They don't call me "lefty" for nothing! ;)
1 Corinthians 1:9
9 God is faithful, through whom you were called into fellowship with His Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

Audie wrote:
"Christianity is not a joke, but it has some very poor representatives."


St. Richard the Sarcastic--The Patron Saint of Irony


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