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by hughfarey
Fri May 12, 2017 5:18 am
Forum: God and Science
Topic: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity
Replies: 213
Views: 3912

Re: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity

Thanks. I'm afraid I don't care for the various 'radiation' hypotheses, and will not be buying an excimer laser machine just yet. There are a number of reasons for this: 1) The problem of how a dead body can emit sufficient radiation to degrade cloth. This breaks down further into: 1.a) A miraculist...
by hughfarey
Thu May 11, 2017 2:50 pm
Forum: God and Science
Topic: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity
Replies: 213
Views: 3912

Re: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity

Yes, it's by Jason Engwer, with whom I have corresponded from time to time, most recently (yesterday) to tell him of my contacting George Rossman.
by hughfarey
Thu May 11, 2017 1:46 am
Forum: God and Science
Topic: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity
Replies: 213
Views: 3912

Re: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity

Incidentally, I was surprised to find that George Rossman still works for Caltech. He has given me permission to quote him: “Every statement about my testing the shroud is total fabrication. It did not happen. I have no idea how or why they chose my name, but it was either a gross mistake on their p...
by hughfarey
Thu May 11, 2017 12:54 am
Forum: God and Science
Topic: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity
Replies: 213
Views: 3912

Re: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity

Yes, I agree with that as far as it goes, but there are two inevitable corollaries to this paper.
a) the inhomogeneity is quite small, to give only 100 years difference across the sample.
b) the closer you get to the corner of the cloth, the older the shroud appears.
by hughfarey
Wed May 10, 2017 7:45 am
Forum: God and Science
Topic: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity
Replies: 213
Views: 3912

Re: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity

Unless some new test shows something far beyond what we now know, I'd say the continued debate is a waste. And if it is authentic, for those who don't want to believe in the event it is tied to, NO amount of evidence will ever convince them. Possibly. And vice versa. There is no need to enter the d...
by hughfarey
Tue May 09, 2017 11:54 pm
Forum: God and Science
Topic: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity
Replies: 213
Views: 3912

Re: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity

"Samples from the main part of the cloth are SIGNIFICANTLY different from the Raes samples with regard to cotton content." Well, fair enough. At least we are agree on our facts, if not the opinions we derive from them. I think the variation in the amount, distribution and provenance of th...
by hughfarey
Tue May 09, 2017 2:34 pm
Forum: God and Science
Topic: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity
Replies: 213
Views: 3912

Re: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity

Rogers never had access to any threads? I don't know if you are being deliberately funny or not... Certainly not. Sure Rogers both handled and studied the Shroud as a whole cloth, but the STuRP team did not extract any threads at all - in fact they, especially Rogers, went to great lengths to cause...
by hughfarey
Tue May 09, 2017 6:18 am
Forum: God and Science
Topic: RTB: Serious Problems with Evolution
Replies: 1164
Views: 26177

Re: RTB: Serious Problems with Evolution

At the level of organism reproduction. If the organism reproduces, the new material is selected. If it doesn't, it isn't.
by hughfarey
Tue May 09, 2017 6:14 am
Forum: God and Science
Topic: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity
Replies: 213
Views: 3912

Re: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity

Again you are wrong on the basic facts. 1. I double checked and confirmed that Ray Rogers did send Fanti an 'Image fiber'. Yes. just read that last word again, would you? Fibre. Quite so. Fibre. Not thread. Threads are made of fibres. A fibre can be linen or cotton or wool, but not a mixture. A thr...
by hughfarey
Mon May 08, 2017 2:46 pm
Forum: God and Science
Topic: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity
Replies: 213
Views: 3912

Re: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity

Well, suit yourself. Ray Rogers had no thread samples from the main part of the cloth, and neither did any of the STuRP team. The Italian contingent, led by Perluigi Baima Bollone, has access to the cloth before STuRP were allowed at it, and extracted several threads, but I don't think they have bee...
by hughfarey
Mon May 08, 2017 12:38 pm
Forum: God and Science
Topic: RTB: Serious Problems with Evolution
Replies: 1164
Views: 26177

Re: RTB: Serious Problems with Evolution

Um. Natural selection mostly works at a higher level than cells. No cell decides anything, even metaphorically. Nor does it matter whether evolution goes backwards or forwards. If the new variation leads to increased reproductive success, it gets transmitted and propagated by reproduction whether th...
by hughfarey
Mon May 08, 2017 12:33 pm
Forum: God and Science
Topic: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity
Replies: 213
Views: 3912

Re: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity

According to Rogers, the reason that the cotton in the main cloth samples wasn't quantified was there was not enough cotton there to quantify. Indeed. But as I said, neither Rogers nor Heller and Adler had any opportunity to study any Shroud threads, as opposed to sticky tapes. Neither were any of ...
by hughfarey
Mon May 08, 2017 12:13 am
Forum: God and Science
Topic: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity
Replies: 213
Views: 3912

Re: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity

Thank you, Gentlemen. 1) (DBowling) There is a difference between trace amounts of cotton on the surface of the Shroud due to contamination and cotton within the fabric of the cloth itself. Quite true. However, it has not been established whether the main body of the Shroud contains significant quan...
by hughfarey
Sun May 07, 2017 12:46 pm
Forum: God and Science
Topic: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity
Replies: 213
Views: 3912

Re: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity

Where I think you are blatantly wrong is your refusal to acknowledge multiple evidences that the cloth in the radiocarbon sample area is different from the cloth in the rest of the Shroud (flax vs cotton, Medieval vs 1st century date, inconsistency in date across the sample, pigment vs no pigment, ...
by hughfarey
Sun May 07, 2017 11:08 am
Forum: God and Science
Topic: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity
Replies: 213
Views: 3912

Re: Shroud of Turin - Summary of Evidence for its Authenticity

The current fantasy is that individual 25 micron diameter threads were unravelled, spliced together with similar threads, and then rewoven to match the original weave. I claim that this is impossible. I claim that it has never been done, and cannot be done. I claim that to say that it might be is a...

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